');

Jump to content


Welcome to The Lotus Forums

Welcome to The Lotus Forums. Please register now to enjoy the full benefits of the forum. It's free, easy and you can even just log in with your facebook/twitter details if you wish or if you're already a member click here to sign in now. Be apart of The Lotus Forums by signing in or creating an account.
  • Start new topics and reply to others, read protected content
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates emailed
  • Get your own profile, add your car to the members garage and start a car blog
  • Customize your experience and profile here and use our free members gallery
Guest Message by DevFuse
Photo

Wow do V8's Rust!


  • Please log in to reply
20 replies to this topic

#1 Roger Moore

Roger Moore

    LOT

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPip
  • 150 posts
  • Joined 18-January 07
  • Name:Anthony Bentley
  • Location:London
  • Car:Esprit 76 S1/ Esprit 79 S2/ 84 Esprit Turbo/ 2000 Esprit V8, Ferrari Testarossa/ 78 308 gt4/ 83 308 GTS/ 88.5 Countach/ 88 Porsche 928/ 70 Trans Am/ 67 Jensen Interceptor

Posted 29 September 2013 - 07:30 PM

I decided to pop my head under my recently acquired 2000, 17000 mile V8 and wow do V8's rust, don't get me wrong nothing major, chassis is perfect, but everything attached to it has rust, nuts, bolts, drive shafts, springs, front suspension etc are coated. The cars mileage is without question correct, the interior is perfect, body perfect. When I was buying it, I peered through the wheels, the callipers they are perfect and clean, the discs have no lip on them at all, I just assumed the car would be like that underneath. Has my car sat somewhere extremely damp or is this common?
I can see this being a pain to work on as things pack up!

#2 Bibs

Bibs

    How fast?

  • CEO
  • 36,013 posts
  • Joined 23-September 04
  • Name:Bibs
  • Location:Blue Bell Hill, Kent, UK
  • Car:2000 Elise S1, 2014 Evora S IPS Sports Racer

Posted 29 September 2013 - 07:35 PM

Most of the fixings are mild steel. Its time, not miles that lead to the corrosion and it's not uncommon, more so in the UK than elsewhere.

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators

 

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Elise S1, Evora S IPS Sports Racer


#3 Trevsked

Trevsked

    Purchasing Department CEO

  • Regional Co-ordinator
  • 2,725 posts
  • Joined 17-June 08
  • Name:Trevor Skedge
  • Location:Rickmansworth
  • Car:Sport 350

Posted 29 September 2013 - 09:09 PM

The V8 is no different from any other Esprit in that respect unfortunately. A little disappointing I know but as you say nothing major.

Trevor.
I'll get around to it at some point.

#4 LooseCannon

LooseCannon

    Threadkiller

  • Moderator
  • 3,996 posts
  • Joined 08-October 04
  • Name:Mark
  • Location:Stuck in the 90s.......
  • Car:1998 Esprit GT3 , Elite Riviera & 1982 Elite auto (projects)
  • Modifications:Stock as a rock.

Posted 30 September 2013 - 12:27 AM

Lotus once had a brief initiative whereby you could email the CEO (Kim Ogaard-Nielsen at the time) and let him know your pet hates about Lotus products, and be sure of a response.

 

Your rust comments were the same as mine, and I asked why it was so noticeable. KON actually did email back and said that individual steel components suffered more on glassfibre cars as there was in issue over earthing, which caused electrolysis to increase (?) or something like that. Chemistry was never a strong suit, but it sounded plausible.

 

Of course I asked if they could spend a few pounds on stainless components but never got an answer that time...


Inside I'm dancing


#5 steve930

steve930

    LOTUS

  • Full Forum Account
  • 436 posts
  • Joined 18-November 10
  • Name:steve
  • Location:dorchester, dorset
  • Car:esprit V8 se / bmw bmw X5 4.6is / vauxhall astra van / renault trafic / sea ray sportscruiser!

Posted 30 September 2013 - 09:32 AM

yep there's truth in that, in my boat (glassfibre) every metallic item has an earth bonding to reduce corrosion levels.
as you can imagine in a saltwater environment the problem is much worse hence why everything is earthed

a case in point. The P.O. of my boat had one of the seacock valves replaced 1yr before I bought the boat. (inline water tap that you turn 90° to open or close) whoever fitted it didn't bother to reconnect the earth strap.
not long after buying the boat I had to replace the pipe connected to the valve, I closed the valve, removed the pipe & had water gushing into the boat! . I connected the hose back up & delayed the job til the boat was out the water in the winter ( it wasn't urgent to replace the pipe)

Boat safely out the water, I discovered the whole innards of the tap had corroded away !!. I fitted a new tap, connected the earth bonding. 3 yrs on (start of this year) I pulled the pipe off the tap & the innards are still in perfect order.

#6 Winter

Winter

    LOTU

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 229 posts
  • Joined 11-March 05
  • Name:Edward M Winter
  • Car:Lotus Esprit V8SE (now sold) 1972 Lotus Europa Special # 63 of 100 special editions. Ferrari F430 F1.

Posted 01 October 2013 - 11:40 AM

Sacrificial anodes . . .



#7 steve930

steve930

    LOTUS

  • Full Forum Account
  • 436 posts
  • Joined 18-November 10
  • Name:steve
  • Location:dorchester, dorset
  • Car:esprit V8 se / bmw bmw X5 4.6is / vauxhall astra van / renault trafic / sea ray sportscruiser!

Posted 02 October 2013 - 06:52 PM

Sacrificial anodes . . .


Only used on the outside of the boat Edward. The skin fitting on the underside of the hull to which the tap is connected has an I.d. of 20mm, as you can imagine there isn't enough metal on the skin fitting to attach a suitable size anode.

The drive unit (leg) on the stern of the boat does have anodes, 7 in total which I have to replace at least every season.

My boat is moored on a pontoon which has an electrical supply, due to the environment said electrical supply often has earth leakage which greatly increases corrosion on the boat. My boat has two "clever boxes of tricks" called galvanic isolators, 1for 12vdc electrics, the other for the 220vac electrics. Both of these units are passively fitted into their respective earth circuits and somehow (read I don't fully understand) shield all metallic items from earth leakage.

neighbouring boats on my pontoon who don't have these isolators installed typically replace their anodes upto 4 times a year, as s further measure, said neighbours also submerge several very large anodes on ropes around their boat

#8 Winter

Winter

    LOTU

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 229 posts
  • Joined 11-March 05
  • Name:Edward M Winter
  • Car:Lotus Esprit V8SE (now sold) 1972 Lotus Europa Special # 63 of 100 special editions. Ferrari F430 F1.

Posted 03 October 2013 - 10:43 AM

Yes, I have a pal who has a narrow boat that has, I think, at least two fitted on the hull below the waterline.

 

It's pity that similar systems haven't been devised for vehicles that have only occasional contact with water by way of rain-related splashes - unless it's a James Bond submarine Esprit.



#9 Roger Moore

Roger Moore

    LOT

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPip
  • 150 posts
  • Joined 18-January 07
  • Name:Anthony Bentley
  • Location:London
  • Car:Esprit 76 S1/ Esprit 79 S2/ 84 Esprit Turbo/ 2000 Esprit V8, Ferrari Testarossa/ 78 308 gt4/ 83 308 GTS/ 88.5 Countach/ 88 Porsche 928/ 70 Trans Am/ 67 Jensen Interceptor

Posted 17 October 2013 - 08:03 PM

I have just put it in for a service and they actually reckon it's not that bad.

#10 Bibs

Bibs

    How fast?

  • CEO
  • 36,013 posts
  • Joined 23-September 04
  • Name:Bibs
  • Location:Blue Bell Hill, Kent, UK
  • Car:2000 Elise S1, 2014 Evora S IPS Sports Racer

Posted 17 October 2013 - 08:07 PM

Who with, LE Marine Services? :lol:


For forum issues, please contact the Moderators

 

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Elise S1, Evora S IPS Sports Racer


#11 cjtpb13

cjtpb13

    LOTUS

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 853 posts
  • Joined 30-January 08
  • Name:International Poolboy
  • Location:California, MD & Trumbull, CT
  • Car:1994 S4

Posted 18 October 2013 - 12:09 AM

Also important to remember that stainless steel hardware is not as strong

#12 alan

alan

    LOTUS

  • Full Forum Account
  • 1,134 posts
  • Joined 27-October 04
  • Name:Alan Tong
  • Location:Barkway, Herts
  • Car:S4s, A8, Tesla Roadster, Tesla Model S on its way

Posted 18 October 2013 - 07:17 AM

Washers etc rust very quickly on most Lotus (and Tesla's).  I had always assumed this was due to Lotus taking the term "penny washer" too literally.  The earthing / lack of sacrifical anode is something I had not thought of.



#13 G4RTHV8

G4RTHV8

    L

  • Basic Account
  • Pip
  • 49 posts
  • Joined 08-January 09
  • Name:GARTH
  • Car:ESPRIT V8 1996

Posted 09 December 2013 - 02:22 PM

Hi Guys,

 

I make a point of replacing the mild steel fittings on my 96 V8 with stainless steel whenever I carry out work in an affected area. Like mild steel, stainless steel comes in varying strength grades, I have found that if you use a dedicated supplier and advise them of the intended use, they will usually recommend the appropriate grade of stainless steel. For nuts bolts and screws I use Orbital Fasteners; for hydraulic fittings I use Hopespares and Pirtek (note the latter will make up just about anything you could want, however you may have to supply the component parts).

 

Once fitted you will never have to struggle with rust-fused threads, snapped studs or heating with a blow torch to get something undone


Edited by G4RTHV8, 09 December 2013 - 02:23 PM.


#14 red vtec

red vtec

    LOTUS

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,036 posts
  • Joined 16-August 05
  • Name:Chris
  • Car:1988 Esprit Turbo

Posted 09 December 2013 - 10:35 PM

would clear waxoyl not help prevent the rust?


Amateurs built the Ark
Professionals built the Titanic


"I haven't ridden in cars pulled by cows before" "Bullocks, Mr.Belcher" "No, I haven't, honestly"

#15 OnAir

OnAir

    LOT

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPip
  • 145 posts
  • Joined 08-December 07
  • Name:Mike
  • Location:Vancouver, Canada
  • Car:2003.5 Final Edition Esprit V8

Posted 10 December 2013 - 05:52 AM

Once fitted you will never have to struggle with rust-fused threads, snapped studs or heating with a blow torch to get something undone

This is true, however I find that stainless steel bolts tend to seize a lot easily than steel. I still prefer stainless, but what a pain when they lock up!



#16 Mark T-C

Mark T-C

    2 Esprits... .maybe, someday... one will run. :)

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,757 posts
  • Joined 22-January 07
  • Name:Otis is the name of my car
  • Car:1988 Esprit Turbo, 2002 Esprit v8, 2010 GTI

Posted 06 February 2014 - 05:04 AM

And... this is why I live in a semi-arid climate... virtually no rust on any of my esprit's.. even my 88 is virtually rust free. I was actually shocked at how well they hold up over the years. I've worked on Honda's that are so rusted after 10 years that you have to cut almost every bolt. I'm especially happy with the galvanized steel frame.
Modifying esprit's.. now that's fun..

PS... I AM NOT A CERTIFIED MECHANIC.. I Have chosen to help those in need, in the past and must not be construed as being a certified technician.

#17 Buddsy

Buddsy

    Im only joiking all of the time!

  • Moderator
  • 6,017 posts
  • Joined 27-July 07
  • Name:Scott
  • Location:Norwich
  • Car:1985 Turbo Esprit
  • Modifications:Oil catch tank only so far.

Posted 06 February 2014 - 10:25 AM

Hi Guys,

 

I make a point of replacing the mild steel fittings on my 96 V8 with stainless steel whenever I carry out work in an affected area. 

 

 

Once fitted you will never have to struggle with rust-fused threads, snapped studs or heating with a blow torch to get something undone

 

Stainless steel bolts are much worse to remove than rusted plated ones. When I started my resto the all my bots were really badly rusted but they all came out fine. I took the decision to replace with plated bolts rather then SS bolts. Personally I think SS in most cases is over rated.

 

Buddsy




Posted Image

#18 hyteck9

hyteck9

    LOT

  • Basic Account
  • PipPipPip
  • 145 posts
  • Joined 24-February 14
  • Name:Brian
  • Location:Ohio
  • Car:99 esprit
  • Modifications:stock

Posted 28 April 2014 - 01:17 PM

My 1999 has 12k miles on it and shows none of the rust you speak of.

 

Must be your environment.  :-)



#19 Jacques

Jacques

    LOTUS

  • Full Forum Account
  • 673 posts
  • Joined 22-November 05
  • Name:Jacques
  • Car:1990 Esprit Turbo SE

Posted 24 June 2014 - 08:42 PM

I've used stainless a2 and a4 bolts, washers and nuts for 25 years on various applications, and they never broke, always stayed in place and never got stuck. Most of the time I've used coppergrease on parts that does not move.

 

Cheers,

Jacques.



#20 march

march

    L

  • Full Forum Account
  • 34 posts
  • Joined 13-May 11
  • Name:Marc Howitt
  • Location:Bridford, Devon
  • Car:Esprit V8 1999
  • Modifications:None - Trying to keep 100% Original

Posted 26 June 2014 - 10:45 AM

I looked into the use of stainless nuts and bolts and was told to avoid using with steel due to Galvanic Corrosion. In the early day I did mix plated and stainless bolts but soon found mild corrosion on the steel components within the year (and the car had only been out of the garage for short periods to have work completed on it). I have also found that marine grease is a good option to limit corrosion as it does not dry / breakdown over time ( I use Quicksilver Lubricant grease 2-4-c with Teflon).

 

I now use this on all nuts and bolts (seems to work well) and try to avoid mixing metals with stainless.

 

For more information on Galvanic Corrosion have a search on Google - there is plenty of information out there.

 

regards,

 

Marc






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users