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C8RKH's Content - Page 426 - The Lotus Forums #ForTheOwners Jump to content


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Everything posted by C8RKH

  1. I here what you are saying Solarshaun and I really do empathise with you. However, the fact is the warranty period is gone and with it Lotus' legal obligations have gone too. I was trying to point out that with most other manufacturers, who let's face it are significantly larger, have much more resources and cash than Lotus, would have told you to go away, but instead, Lotus stepped up and offered £500 - which is £500 more than other manufacturer would usually offer outside of warranty. Your contract for purchase is with the dealer, not Lotus, whether you buy new or 2nd hand. So can I ask what the dealer has done to stand behind the car that they sold you? Did they consider matching Lotus's generous offer? After all, don't forget that when you buy a 2nd hand Lotus (sorry if my assumption you did not buy it new is wrong) Lotus see's no benefit from that at all. Lotus gets cash when they first sell the car and on spares bought from them. It is the dealers that make cash EVERY time the car changes hands. It is the dealers who make cash every time it is serviced or repaired. So it should be the dealers, who really are the "custodians" of the relationship, who should be stepping up to the plate, and Lotus in my opinion anyway. By all means AFTER they have resolved the customers issue they should go back to the factory to get support for their actions and costs, but this should not be done by the consumer, if the problem is indeed a manufacturing / defect one. Are dealers just like Bankers, WHSmith and Boots these days? Out to fleece their customers and make a quick buck and hang the long term consequences? How many stories of dealers avoiding their responsibilities and just blaming Lotus and insisting that only Lotus provide the support? Is this really right and if so, why then should we use these dealers and not just start to buy the cars direct from the factory and take them there for servicing as what actual value are the dealers really providing? Interested in people's thoughts here. I hear a lot of stories on the various forums saying Lotus this and Lotus that, but in reality, the first point of customer contact, and the first point of accountability for customer service is with the dealers. That's why my reaction to the clutch fluid issue above was different to your clutch. It was a nearly new car still within first year of warranty and the real cost was tiny (to the dealer) etc. At the end of the day, depending on when you bought your car, how long you have had it and how many miles done, your major recourse is under the Sales of Goods Act 1979 and subsequent revisions which says the item you bought must be supplied and be fit for the use intended and this includes reasonable durability and wear. If it is within 6-9 months of your purchase, and a manufacturing defect as you suspect, then you have a strong claim as it would be "reasonably" expecting to not fail. Your recourse through this route is through your dealer (where you may be able to reject the car and hand it back) or through any finance company (including credit card company if you paid at least the deposit on your credit card - I think over £1k). One of the very under-looked at reasons for buying a car, even part buying, under finance is this added protection which is hard for the finance companies to wiggle out from. If you have the cash you can of course pay off the "debt" at any time to restrict your interest total but the "protection" still remains. Sorry you took exception when I stated you "slagged" off Lotus for ONLY giving you £500 - I meant no offence though I'm also not sure what other term to use probably due to my deficiency with the English language. But as per my posts and others, I think your ire in this instance is being targeted at the wrong organisation and your dealer should have possibly done a lot more to support you. I think as a group of marque enthusiasts and owners, we need to more demanding with the main dealers, and I see from posts elsewhere that two dealers who have had "complaints" re service quality etc are now leaving the marque. So maybe we can make a difference. Whatever, you still have my sympathies for such a catastrophic and expensive failure, and I certainly will not be screeching away from the lights in my Evora in 1st any time soon!
  2. Mystery solved, well done Bibs. For your next mystery how about solving the conundrum that is the Bermuda Triangle or how Timothy Dalton landed the role of Bond, James Bond! Even though the car is not a wide track, it's still a very nice nit of kit with a good story, now known provenace etc so all hopefully good.
  3. I agree Sellman. Sometimes I think the dealers just need to take a step back, a deep breath, and then do the right thing. The real cost to the dealer (minus vat) was probably around £30 for the fluid and £20 for the effort, so a £50 hit for someone who lashed what, £50k?, £55k? On a new car from you a few months ago. Yup, that'll get them right back through your door when it comes to them changing their car, and you just may miss out on the £400 - £600 annual service too etc. Gotta love long term customer centric thinking.
  4. @Bullphi I think your supplying dealer has been a tad shortsighted. I'd have probably made a scene in his showroom and made it clear I wouldn't be buying another car from them. But then I do like to play the drama queen.
  5. I agree Willi, just trying to show how relatively "hard" it is for a British Company like Lotus compared to some of its much bigger European counterparts who can sometimes benefit from very generous state intervention (and I not talking about inward investment, R&D grants etc). Germany is not so bad really and is actually going through some pretty fundamental changes in reality, just don't get me started on the protectionist French who have been "subsidising" their large corporations out of general taxation for years and seemingly getting away with it without too much flak from Brussels or the rest of the EU.
  6. He posted his "letter" on SELOC @PaulCP and he has been well and truly destroyed on the forum there, to the extent, that he has now deleted the contents of his OP. But he is still getting battered.... TLF seems a much "nicer" place to frequent
  7. @Snoopy1969 - part of the issue here with "hire and fire" approaches is a general difference in our economies, culture and also the government support available to companies. In Germany, many manufacturing (and others) companies can apply to the German government to provide "short-time working subsidies" which essentially provides a significant percentage of the employees wages as a government subsidy and enables the manufacturing companies to keep skilled workers on their books, on short-time, at a vastly reduced cost. This is not an option in the UK for companies like Lotus. In France, the workers rights are even more strongly protected and it is even harder to down size or right size our employee base. This is partly why the French manufacturing economy is in such a bad way as they run a permanently high cost base through both the good times and the bad times. The assumption seems to have been made that the 300 people or so laid off were doing the same jobs as th 200 or so people who have been rehired. I don't believe this was the case. I agree that job cuts and wage cuts, are not motivational. However, some times, for the betterment of the whole, companies need to re-size / down-size / or re-skill to deal with the present and future needs, whilst not being beholden to the past needs. I think Lotus' approach of bringing on a significant number of apprentices is an enlightened one, as many seasoned Lotus employees will take great pride in sharing their skills and knowledge with these apprentices, and they will get a lot of pride and job satisfaction out of seeing these apprentices develop and grow. That has to be seen as a good move. On a final point. If wages are cut, then as long as management accepts its part in the decisions that have been taken to create the scenario resulting in the need to reduce wages, and that management then subsequently also partake in an accepting the same % wage cut, then all is good. These days, too often it seems, the management are quick to act on workers whilst forgetting in many instances it is the actions and decisions of managers and management that has created the predicament.
  8. I tend to agree with Barry that Lotus have been more than genererous, and I say this as a 2010 Evora owner who may suffer the same issue at any time. It's a difficult one to call but a warranty is just that - it is a guarantee if you like of help and support that has a fixed start date and a fixed end date - it has to have, as otherwise when would a warranty end and the manufacturers obligation cease? I think you are being a bit disrespectful to Lotus here, who again, seem to have gone some way to standing beside their product and their customer when the warranty has EXPIRED. As Bary has said, try that with any of the big manufacturers - who have volume, scale and financial clout (Lotus have none of these things) and you will get laughed out of the service office 9.5 times out of ten. VW, Porsche, MB, Jaguar, Ford, BMW, LR, etc. would all be the same. Yet teeny weeny tiny Lotus gives you £500 and they get slagged for it. I bought my 2010 car in April of this year. I paid 50% of what it would have cost new so saved a huge wedge of cash and Lotus got or gets no benefit of me buying that car other than the addition of an enthusiast for the marque who may, or may not, in the future go on to buy another Lotus and maybe even a new one. In the first 6 months of ownership if my clutch had / does explode like yours my ire and frustration will be levelled at the dealer who sold me the car, not Lotus who made it 5 years ago. I'd expect the dealer to stand by the car they sold me. I'd expect them to negotiate with the warranty company as they provided me with (and I paid for) the warranty based on their advice to assist with issues like this. And this is why I choose to buy, from an approved dealer. I don't know, maybe I am out of kilter with the rest of the world. Maybe I am too soft these days. Maybe I'm just a dickhead. But it does seem that people are never satisfied and feel that when something goes wrong someone else always need to be blamed and someone else always needs to pay for it. Mechanical stuff breaks and with cars there is no guarantee that it hasn't been influenced by use or other factors. Shit just happens sometimes. Shit will continue to just happen and sometimes it is no-bodies fault it is just unfortunate that it has happened to you. But, in this instance, at least you were £500 better off thanks to a small niche manufacturer who tried to support and help a customer 4 years+ after a car was made and sold. Just a view. Not saying I am right and you are wrong. We all can have a different perspective.
  9. Sorry for the potentially dumb question but is Hermiston Gait the shopping complex with halfords/B&Q etc near to MMC's place? If so, I'll be there for 0845
  10. ^^^^ Alfa2Evora. There is humour. There is satire. And dare I say it there is comedy. But this year, you suggesting we have even seen the sun, let alone felt its heat, in Scotland, is just pure piss taking. Cease and desist, right now....!
  11. Sounds like your getting out a lot in the Evora Dave. Still making you smile?
  12. OK, I'll get me order in quick then... 4 tyres ordered, great price and they seem to be going fast...
  13. I take it these are the "correct" MO and MO1 compound tyres? - just checking....
  14. It does look like it is on rails going through those corners......
  15. Yup - just checked out the Hull to Zeebrugge ferry and will get in to Zeebrugge at 0900 Thursday morning - so all day to blast around Belgium lanes roughly heading towards Spa with lunch at Waterloo (just so I can take pictures to annoy my French colleagues - hahaha) Meet my two Pals who can drive up the coast road from Calais, past Dunkirk to meet south of Brugges. Looks like it is happening.
  16. OK looks like I am in for this one Cocopops, going for the Friday all day session. Just need to look into Ferries from Scotland, so that probably means Hull to Rotterdam!!! Will be bringing two mates from down in Englandshire - Rob in a Lotus 340r and Alex who is yet to decide between his Elise and McLaren 675s (yes, I hate him too!) Looking forward to it though will probably need 4 new tyres before I go, so getting a tad expensive
  17. I was just thinking the re the C&C ad for the Lotus Esprit - £55k as it was the "one" from the Roger Moore 007 Bond launch etc. But no real provenance so a huge premium that some unsuspecting poor bugger could possibly get "done" for. And then there have been over the years with Lotus a myriad number of special editions and one-offs etc, some with good provenance and a good well documented history, some not so good that seem to get argued about every few years. Just think for all concerned and for the good of the marque (especially where current and past production numbers are low so good cars in the future will be sought after) the time to clear up "issues" around provenance etc is now, whilst the right people are in post and still alive, rather than in 20 or 30 years time. As for dealers - I never believe a word they tell me unless it is backed up by some proof, preferably written, and preferably from at least 2 different sources
  18. Wow, this thread is deteriorating a tad and getting a bit snipey. Surely the someone well connected could easily validate this with the guys at the factory and/or Motorsport. Probably best in everyone's interest to understand the history, legacy, etc etc and get it properly documented to avoid confusion in the future.
  19. Haven't you got a nappy to change and a cradle to rock Buddsy? Get on with it man and leave the review to us nappyless souls. No problem doing the Evora review, we have a twice daily flight from Edinburgh to Norwich and my phone has a camera with a video setting. When will the car be ready for me, Thursday ok?
  20. @demiruyar at the end of the day you will buy what you perceive is the best car for you. However, I will state for the record that comments like yours, as pointed out earlier, really do hack me off. Why you may rightly ask? Well firstly, you are writing one product off, in favour of another, when I suspect you have actually driven neither. So how can that be (a) logical and (b) fair? Secondly, why are you even comparing the Evora against a Cayman GT4? They are different cars - the GT4 is the current pinnacle of Cayman motoring and engineering. The Evora 400 is the base model in the range, albeit a new facelifted range. As such, have you compared the base 911 or 911 S to the GT4 and come to the same conclusion that they have no chance against the GT4? A far more sensible comparison would be Evora 400 vs 911 base. When the Evora Cup or Cup R (or whatever they will be called) comes out they can be pitched against the Carrera S or higher power spec 911 models, but NOT against the Cayman. The Exige is taking on that fight and doing not bad as price for performance and when Evora 400 trimetc quality ripples down to it, as 911 did to Cayman, I believe Porsche will have a real fight on its hands. I bought an Evora because like a 911 it is a grown up car. If I'd have wanted a screamer I'd have bought a Cayman S / GTS / whatever or an Exige V6, Cup or Cup R. Different horses for different courses but let's compare apples to apples and let the Porsche influenced journo's stick to apples to pear comparisons. Like you, I like to express my views but hopefully they are balanced and considered too as opposed to just throw away one liners which add no flavour to the soup.
  21. @demiruyar - OK, I'm intrigued, why do you think the Evora 400 "has no chance"?
  22. Just ordered mine from him Cocopops and will post up a picture on Saturday when back home.
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