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modifiedv8engines

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  1. Many Thanks. Will update this post when I get to that steady state Mike, soon-ish I hope.
  2. Bloody marvelous - after chasing this problem for a few weeks and doing this that and the other...think I have solved it, well almost. Yesterday after yet more extensive reading, fired up the engine again ( no cats etc) ....let it warm a bit and blipped the throttle several times........voila ! .............no smoke haze As per above, old Siemens relay fitted so can only conclude its a intermitant relay fault/issue. Not wanting to tempt fate but expect if I try again today it may be okay or not .......relay or relay socket as this area is under the rear wing mountings so water may have got in there perhaps. Need to order another so that part number if not available from Lotus would be very helpful (or a link to the your post sailor bob). Looking at the positives, new plugs, injectors seals, secondary seals, coil packs, fuel pumps, fuel filter, tank cleaned out, fresh fuel and various checks on injectors for flow etc etc. So those are known to be good and shouldnt play up for some time. Brilliant help and without this forum I would have been well and truly knackered. ( Whoops I still havent renewed my subs) ....get that done today Bibs !
  3. Minded you mentioned that some time ago Mike.....could be that I suppose so just need to find a local car to test my ECU.
  4. Thanks Mike Did I read somewhere the Brown SEIMANS Fuel Pump Relay was a the only relay suitable for these cars ? Replaced with a new Land Rover AMR something or other - Put the old Siemans relay back in and seems to spin the engine over much faster !!! (stumbled on this one when removing fuel pump relays to double check for sparks from the coil, leads to the plugs ) If I pull the fuel pump relay to isolate the injectors and pump - I get no sparks to an earth position, like a plenum bolt and by that I mean spare plug, pushed into plug boot and earthed) With cat pipes removed @ idle no oil/fuel smoke ......apply some throttle and smoke haze on the overun on bank #1 turbo but no oil.... just smoke.........like its over fueling Bank #2 turbocharger wastegate poppet valve loose/rattling so that helps to partly explain the rattles/popping noises from exhaust which I wouldnt of found without removal so solved something today. Seem to be going round and round in circles thinking haunted, thinking ghostbusters I really cant think WTF is going on with this car injectors, secondary injector seals, coil packs etc etc all of which have been checked or tested and still not much further forward ..
  5. Had a good search but does not appear to be any write ups on V8 turbocharger removal (engine in situ). Any tips would be most grateful .......guessing crow-foot wrenches for the mtg to the exhaust manifold but no doubt once the car is supported on stands and the next several hours with dust, grit, coolant and oil dripping in my eyes and face I will have another job crossed off the list.
  6. Have similar issue with near side door. Another one of those jobs that have been on the "to do" list but just not got around to it yet. Would be interested to know if you solve. Cheers Paul
  7. Make of the following what you will and its probably your explanation Sailor Bob thats close/correct. To recap - Compression test pressure range within approx 1 bar. Hot Comp test ( lost count of how many) but both middle cylinders on both banks give a slightly lower compression pressure so thats cylinders 2,3, 6,7. Cylinders, 1,4,5,8 higher Leak down test ( Sealey VSE 2060 ) pressure 25 psi as recommended by Sealey technical support ( not a bad tool for £45 quid) but disregard the instructions as the leak gauges will hit the stops if you use 100psi). Blurb says bigger capcity engines tend to leak more than smaller capacity engines but fail to give an example. Leak down pressure recorded as moderate on a cold engine which indicates 35% leakage. This was for cylinders 1,2, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8 with cylinder #4 slightly better @ 25% Pressure leakage to crankcase via piston rings - no hissing from inlet, exhaust, or air bubbles from header tank. Not too alarmed at those results and with cats removed which are clear/clean, Im reasonably confident that the bank # 1 turbocharger is at fault. Weather depending ......will re-install spark plugs tomorrow, start engine and see if the impellors are spinning, as the shafts in both units have some slack/play but other than oil deposits on bank #1, look okay-ish.
  8. Thanks guys.........thats really very useful information and no doubt will assist others too when they get to that stage where they need to reach for that compression tester.
  9. Derek its nice of you to point this out but all Im trying to find out is irrespective of the laws of physics and yes we know when gases are compressed, heat, expand etc but has anybody .........actually measured the compression ratio ( or pressure ) of their Esprits V8 engines other than me as I would like establish a comparison....thats all. My question if its answerable is 2.0,2.2, 3.5 litre Lotus engines all run a 8.0:1 CR piston yet the cylinder pressures are very different - 1.2 bar difference due to cam duration and valve lift ? Or some actual results from compression pressures from a 4 cylinder ......you know, the half a V8 engine version Answers on a post card please
  10. Something else to consider Derek .......based on the compression number in this case 8 x Atmospheric pressure 14.7 /1 = 117.6psi. So Lotus added another several psi to get to 155 apparently .......that is indeed a big effect ! Based on that, the 4 cylinder engines would appear to have less duration and lift perhaps with a peak of 140 psi . Then there is the accuracy of the gauge, if its sealed correctly, engine temp, and the speed at which the battery/starter is able to spin the engine.
  11. Ah Ha .....thats even better news ....... Maybe some adaptive story telling to match my diagnosis here but could it be the damaged turbo seal, or whatever has pumped some oil through the intake and #4 cylinder being the closest to the TB, it gets the oil first .........this is a thought but would need to have a fag and a cuppa to think more about this possibility. Another point of interest The 4 cylinder cars 910/912 engines run 8.0:1 CR with a compression pressure quoted as 9.5 bar (140 lbs in2) The 8 cylinder cars 918 engines run 8.0:1 CR with a compression pressure quoted as 10.7 bar (155 lbs in2) So the V8s get another 1.7 bar pressure ?? from the same compression ratio ! Manual has a typo error there !! So can anyone enlighten us to some measured compression pressure numbers ( actual not from the manual) please.
  12. I suspect the oil seal which is not unlike a piston ring has cracked or has started to wear on the shaft. This may explain the smoke haze and also that the turbos are not working hard when the vehicle is stationary. On boost a different situation would exist and agree, would result in plumes of smoke if it let go then. Given the various issues before and with an expired MOT test, I was unwilling to try the car on the road as in its initial problem state, it ran on less than 8 cylinders and would have a job explaining to the local police what I was doing if the car broke down (and the issue of recovery) . All tests therefore are stationary and not under load or driving conditions Impellor has some free movement and spins but I wouldnt say excessive but on removal I can check the compressor side for damage then. Seem to be going round in circles with this as results are varying with compression tests and variations in recorded values. With oil present on spark plug cylinder #4 this indicates oil is entering the cylinder and having an effect on comp testing.. the 10 BAR reading ....perhaps as the volume of oil would reduce the chamber volume and result in a higher reading. Would be interested what others have recorded for cylinder compression as the 10.7 BAR value seems high for an engine that has 8.5:1 or thereabouts compression spec. Leak down to perform when weather permits but even this is a bit of a challenge as crank pulley difficult to work with unless car on ramp and I have no hydraulic ramp. 4th gear and hand brake will suffice or if it fails..... a new fence !
  13. Not to be beaten (yes I know some blokes even pay good money for that), I decided to carry out a engine hot comp test. Strangely the previous cylinder # 4 which was @ 10 BAR has now dropped slightly to 9.5 BAR and cylinder #1 now @ 9 BAR. Repeated test several times to get a mean value but battery said thats enough so couldnt continue. Temps (used infra red thermometer) prior to test show exterior cats of approx 25 - 30 deg C variation with Bank #1 being the cooler ......all a bit strange. Removed rear tail pipe sections and then inspected cat sections best I could as cats visable from the back but not the front as there is a exhaust pipe bend in the way. Cat section removed Here we go....... Bank #1 turbo oil seals have gone or are leaking with oil having a cooling effect (and possibly causing some restriction to flow) on the cat on this side. Other side looks okay with no signs of leakage. Cant be sure until removed and inspected but suspect the high pitched dentist type drill noise I heard a few weeks ago was/is the turbo impeller,debris or similar letting go in the compressor side. From the back view with turbo on the engine, no signs of damage and shaft spins or at least rotates. Leak - down test to perform next as it was considered better to remove exhaust to check for leakage in that location as well as the other areas like crankcase ( oil filler, dip stick tube), and TB etc etc Looks a bit of a bastard of job to remove the turbo but what goes on next (engine out or in) will be determined by the results of the air leakage test.
  14. Thanks for the encouragement Mike. Its needed ! Yes these are wonderful cars if not a bit fragile at times. They do as you know need lots of careful maintenance and when they are good, they are very good. Shame I have missed the good weather with this car this year but fortunately I have other vehicles to use so can look into this further when I get around to it. Big thanks again for your support and the others who contributed to this thread. All part of the learning process and another lesson learnt in not relying on software to diagnose faults...... Cheers Paul
  15. Thinking ............For Sale ......Low Comp Esprit V8......we shall see. The price I suppose for owning a high performance vehicle but if nothing else, have built several V8s over the years but this ones just a bit more complicated and parts are mostly quite difficult and costly. Anyone know when the next Lotus sale is due !
  16. Many thanks for responding Mike. I checked the 02 sensor heaters for continuity and all 4 checked out okay, so from the speadsheet data and your interpretation, that all seems okay. However and this I think this is the problem.........removed sparks plugs and carried out a compression test. Not sure why I have left this to almost last but was convinced this was not an issue. Gauge I have has flexible extension but at least I obtained some results which are results if nothing else... a bit depressing tbh. Will re-test again when I get a proper extension to enure the seal is 100% but I doubt there will be a significant difference Tests carried out 3x with WOT as below (cool engine) .....couple hours after running Cylinders # 1,2,3 all read = 8 BAR Cylinder # 4 reads = 10 BAR Cylinders # 5,6,7,8 = 8 BAR Couple of squirts of engine oil down each bore and compression pressures the same/very similar. All plugs clean other than # 4 (the 10 BAR pressure cylinder) ....light oil deposits ? Manual says 10.7 +/- 1 BAR so @ 8 BAR its a valve train or possible bore, rings issue. Maybe leakage into cylinder bores or gummed piston rings perhaps caused by ingress of rain water in plug wells ...... Last year car ran well, this year one good run early July and then problems. Esprit software says, relays, fuel pumps or short but no engine check light and only the P1101 code. I really cant fathom how the engine can go from good to bad this quickly as there was zero evidence of any issues previous to this year. This seems to be fairly common with random issues So what to do next ? Tempted to try some fuel injector cleaner in the cylinder bores and leave that to soak and see if this restores the compression . Bit of a desperate measure but maybe worth a try as its looking like an engine out, rebuild etc etc Sorry for running on
  17. Bore scope resolution not particularly good so scratch that idea. Lamda sensors wont budge so will need to remove exhaust to check cats it seems and reove lamdas on the bench with some heat. Not completely defeated yet so Have however managed a "snap shot" of current engine running data. Im more than a bit uncertain of whats going on here as Bank #1 Pre cat sensor appears very lean and ST and LT fuel trims all over the place which may be expected if the ECU is trying to add fuel and then not .....perhaps. Attached brief log if anyone can help to interpret Cheers OBDIILOG.csv
  18. Thanks Chris I use the PNM centre exit exhausts with some ceramic 200 CEL cats that I "made fit" some time ago. I have a bore scope kicking about somewhere so will have a look/see to whats going on there. Close to giving up and leaving until next year or something but thats todays mood..... if you know what I mean. Thanks again for the advise though as it may well be these causing the issues......the temp difference between banks 1 & 2 suggests these or the lamdas are at fault but seems what I think the problem is, always turns out to be something else. Checked most things but not all .......... Will post again with more news shortly
  19. Sadly the new fuel pumps are not the problem so although the software gave a P1101 Fuel Pump and Relay fault code for Bank #1 ....its not those. Fresh fuel replaced old fuel to illiminate a potential stale fuel situation Ran engine for a few minutes and can feel a difference in exhaust pressure Bank #1 feels lower pressure - in a flash of inspiration, checked the cats for temp. Bank #1 shows approx 115 deg C and Bank #2 175 deg C Next is to let everything cool down ( and me) and swap the lamda sensors over left to right and if this proves inconclusive possibly look at the cat converters (these were replaced a few years ago < 1500mls). Maybe able to swap the post and pre cat sensors if this is possible ??? any advise on that Im all ears Getting to be less and less to check so depending on the outcome of the above.......its compression test. If thats within specs its looking like FPR ?? or ECU ......or something else
  20. Just waiting for the Kent Moore tool to arrive (Massive thanks to Mike S) so I can re-install the fuel pump assembly. Will keep this post updated on what happens next....hopefully this will solve the problem.
  21. Many Thanks and yes I had seen that. I have a new fuel pump assembly which came from Lotus - interestingly the new pump has wire reinforced blue hoses which are not likely to collapse with age/fuel soak. Old black hoses had not perished but were very soft ........doubt it but could have been nipped up under pump suction if the pump was blocked ...... Will enquire about the sta-bil addative and see what I can find out. Cheers
  22. Having owned my Esprit V8 for several years and since I have other vehicles and not as much time to enjoy as I would like, I have recently had issues with idle speed misfire/splutters. Esprit does very few miles a year and used only during warmer months so for much of the time its unused, not often started and usually has a few gallons of super unleaded in the tank when not being used. When I use it, its battery connected, crank a few times and usually fires up good. In my other posts I have detailed the symptoms and on the advise of other forums members, (thanks again those who offered advise) changed this that and other in an attempt to cure this problem. I have found that my fuel pumps are faulty with evidence of the pump assembly electrical connector getting a bit too warm for comfort ( not melted but not far off) . This electrical connect sits on top of the fuel pump assembly and under that are the connecting harnesses to both fuel pumps. Since there is not supposed to be air in this area, a fire or explosion is reckoned to be unlikely but irrespective of that , its a bit of a worry. Not had this issue before but maybe I have been just lucky. My conclusion and not 100% sure on this, is this issue is related to fuel going stale. Esprits are not really winter drivers and most are wrapped up in the warm during the less favourable British weather. Would be particularly interested if any members have has similar issues or can recommend a good fuel stabilizer or whats the recommended course of action other than driving the car all year round.
  23. Scratch what I said a fuse protection .....Ah I see there is fuse protection ( silly arse ! as Mike already said to disable fuel pump and injectors - fuse B3) but fuse okay and didnt short/trip . Can only summise the slightly charred wires on the fuel pump top plate (yellow block) are due to additional current draw possibly due to old fuel in the tank, a blockage, corrosion or the old pump was just tired out and working flat out to maintain pressure. This may well have been the cause for the high pitched noise I heard from under the rear off-side engine bay area and posted a querry about that a few weeks ago . One good and mostly new fuel pump assembly made up and ready to attempt fitting shortly.
  24. Thanks Mike - Further investigation and just this second searched - the part number on the component is DELCO 16196060 with a description Fuel Pump Tank Vapour Vent Evap Pressure Sensor.....so similar to what you said. Bit stumped as the yellow 4 wire connector is burnt and cant remove that or the new plug/harness to swap over. They are secured on the underside with a small stainless steel clamp ring but cant be removed without destroying so it looking a awkward job to swap them over. Plan was to reuse the top plate with its attached tube and fitting as this accommodates that pressure sensor, the new yellow 4 way connector and replace the old pumps with the new. More than a bit concerned that the wires to the yellow plug had got that hot when a tank containing fuel is on the other side of the pump to tank top plate. Appears not to be any fuse protection unless the relay for the fuel pump is at fault.
  25. Foiled again ! New Lotus supplied V8 fuel Pump assembly has no facility to mount the electrical 3 way connector on the top plate (not the yellow 4 wire connector, thats the same) . The assembly removed has a black 3 way plug and when viewed from the underside has a hole to mount on to a spigot on the top plate. There is a tang which is bent over to hold this connector in place so its not looking like it was intended to ever remove this component - is this a valve/sensor to shut off the fuel pump in case of roll -over for example ? Service notes - section EMH.3, page 12, the illustration shows without that plug but just a dimple where the 3 way connector would install. My new pump is the same .....unfortunately Can anyone enlighten me as to the function or otherwise of the 3 way connector/sensor please. Camera battery dead so cant post just at the minute ....sorry.
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