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EMU Black ECU


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Interesting read about changing ECUs.   My local race shop/Lotus specialist has been encouraging me to do the same....they want me to go with MoTeC.

Tuning the engine would be ta snap and, as mentioned above, the MAF is out and MAP is in.  ;)

My only issue is that I don't want to be THE "science project" and have my car laid up while they work on getting the  MoTeC to control the X-trac functions.  They say no problem, but since they haven't done it, I have my concerns.   I know there are V6CupR's with the X-trac running after-market ECU's in Europe but I'm still reluctant to be the guinea pig, as everything works great now.  A bit more power would always be welcome -- the tranny can definitely handle more torque.  :D

 

Jack
2008 2-Eleven
2015 Exige V6 CupR
Track videos ... http://www.youtube.com/jackcup
2010 Lotus Challenge Series ULTRA Class champion
2012 Lotus CUP USA OPEN Class champion

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@Mattmahope Good question about how the different ECU's compare. Syvecs seems to be in its own league seen to size/possibilities/price.

When I scouted for a candidate early last year I found the Delta 800 to be really attractive, even though I never got confirmed if they could offer full OBD II functionality for MOT and for sending data to Harry's lap timer etc. The reason why I went for the EMU Black was mainly because that was what Track-Group and RRR offered and it fulfilled my wishlist.

I scanned the documentation for both of them right now and as objective I can be I get the impression first of all that both are very capable and offers integration with Lotus, but differs as follows:

Delta 800

  • Larger, but with more pins (70)
  • General description of protection, safety etc
  • Handles 6-18 V
  • Full 8 cylinder functionality
  • Lager number of inputs/outputs and more general purpose
  • Two lambda sensor inputs is probably the main difference
  • Higher resolution in ignition and fueling maps (32x32)
  • Offers VVT, Traction control and Boost control, but no details
  • Information about Transient fueling control
  • Indicates that it provides a lot of functionality and configuration freedom

EMU Black

  • Smaller, with slightly less pins (63)
  • Tested against all kinds of standards
  • Handles 6-22 V
  • More detailed documentation with exact specification of Voltage, Ampere etc
  • Full 6 cylinder functionality with option to use some other pins to run 8
  • More dedicated inputs/outputs (2 exhaust temp for example)
  • Flex fuel input (E85) is the main advantage in sensor inputs
  • It has 3 switch inputs, but maybe the Delta handles that with internal configuration?
  • Less resolution (16x20) in ignition and fueling maps, but double maps
  • Details about VVT, Boost and Traction control map resolution

I think you should have worked with the systems to fully pin point the difference. For me E85 capability is extremely valuable for future upgrades without having an intercooler. In UK, it might not me worth much. With a tuning company knowing what they are doing and being familiar with the ECU they provide, level of documentation is a non-issue. What I know about the ECU Master software is that I can acess everything directly, like mapping the Traction Control knob I sourced from the local representative. That takes 5 minutes with no prior experience of that ECU.

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1 hour ago, Jack said:

Interesting read about changing ECUs.   My local race shop/Lotus specialist has been encouraging me to do the same....they want me to go with MoTeC.

Tuning the engine would be ta snap and, as mentioned above, the MAF is out and MAP is in.  ;)

My only issue is that I don't want to be THE "science project" and have my car laid up while they work on getting the  MoTeC to control the X-trac functions.  They say no problem, but since they haven't done it, I have my concerns.   I know there are V6CupR's with the X-trac running after-market ECU's in Europe but I'm still reluctant to be the guinea pig, as everything works great now.  A bit more power would always be welcome -- the tranny can definitely handle more torque.  :D

 

My understanding is that Motec is basically the best, and therefore naturally the most expensive, option!

In your case it may well be worth it, but I think Motec is massive overkill for a road or track day car. The other options are literally half the price and I expect would do everything required for most purposes that people have, other than the extreme modified race cars perhaps.

But figuring out which is the “best of the rest” is currently proving difficult!

Edited by Mattmahope
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So, after much research and debate, I have placed an order for the ECU Master Black with various sensors, which will be installed by BoT and then mapped by RRR. Fingers crossed!

Will post results in due course...

On 14/06/2019 at 13:40, electro_boy said:

Yep my Evora NA is currently at ES motorsport getting a few power mods done.  Original plan was for induction kit, exhaust headers, new cams and aftermarket ECU with custom mapping.

There was a problem at the cam manufacturer and the delay would be too long so I'm getting everything apart from the cams done and I'll take it back later on in the year for the cams.

The ECU swap will keep full OEM functionality apart form TMPS sensors sometimes these can be a bit iffy.  ES Motorsports have asked SCS to try and fix this but I haven't asked if they were successful and it was a feature I was willing to give up.  Traction control is present and I believe the setting that ES / SCS use allows a bit more playful nature in standard mode and as far as I understand you can tweak the settings in the code not sure about adding a rotary knob to adjust, I'll ask when I go to pick the car up and I'm not sure how it works with the traction control system in the Exige which I think is self learning to grip conditions on track etc ..  again I'll ask a bit more info on this when I go to pick up.

The cam profile they had in mind for me would have kept the car still very drivable on the road no rough idle, emissions will naturally increase from the mods but should just about be fine for MOT (hopefully!).  They can go more aggressive on the cams if you want but what you gain on track performance you loose in everyday drivability.  There were no mods to injectors or valve system needed with my cam change.

I due to pick up the car on Monday so will report back after then (please be dry and sunny when I drive home 🤞🏾😁)

Any update @electro_boy? Did you manage to collect your car yesterday?

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Yep picked up the car on Monday and I'm pretty happy with the work they've done, car sounds amazing now and you can feel the extra power at the top end of the rev range.  I'll make a new post with details of the work as its probably not appropriate on this thread.

But regarding the questions you had earlier.

Traction control - Basically put the Delta ECU that ES Motorsports use has ability to use what you want.  You can put your own parameters or use the factory parameters and you can retain the race mode that the V6 Exiges and the newer Evora have.  It is possible to add a rotary dial to easily switch between different modes but SCS (the ECU suppliers) or you will have to code this up on the ECU they don't have the feature currently but as far as they understand it is possible.  The setting they have put on my Evora is a bit less intrusive than the factory setting even in non sport mode so should be a bit more fun and engaging when driven at the limit.

Regarding CAM profiles - the profiles are defined by ES motorsports and sent to piper cams to get machined from blanks.  They have been refining the profile over time and are pretty pleased with what they have at the moment.  It shifts the torque further up the rev range so the engine keeps pulling in the higher revs, there is small loss at the lower end of the rev range but most if not all of that is regained by using the variable timing.  They also said yes they can go more aggressive if that's what you want but as said earlier it turns it into a track day / race day engine and not so good for the road.  The cam change required some other hardware changing to I think they said the followers or springs are also changed but did not mention the injectors.  They know the Toyota engines well and run many race cars so think they know their stuff pretty well, have a chat to them with your requirements and I'm sure they can come up with a solution.

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  • 6 months later...
On 14/06/2019 at 14:40, electro_boy said:

.... The ECU swap will keep full OEM functionality ...

 

Hello  electro_boy

What you write is very interesting!

I am still considering whether to install the "ECU Master EMU Black" or the "SCS Delta 800" in my EVORA S.

For me, almost the most important thing is that all original CAN bus functions and full OEM functionality are guaranteed. (Included OBD II)

Please report if everything works as in the original and if not, what are the differences to the OEM functionality.

I am looking forward to your feedback.

Greetings from Germany / Hamburg

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On 14/06/2019 at 17:13, #84 said:

@Mattmahope

I scanned the documentation for both of them right now and as objective I can be I get the impression first of all that both are very capable and offers integration with Lotus, but differs as follows:

Delta 800

  • Larger, but with more pins (70)
  • General description of protection, safety etc
  • Handles 6-18 V
  • Full 8 cylinder functionality
  • Lager number of inputs/outputs and more general purpose
  • Two lambda sensor inputs is probably the main difference
  • Higher resolution in ignition and fueling maps (32x32)
  • Offers VVT, Traction control and Boost control, but no details
  • Information about Transient fueling control
  • Indicates that it provides a lot of functionality and configuration freedom

EMU Black

  • Smaller, with slightly less pins (63)
  • Tested against all kinds of standards
  • Handles 6-22 V
  • More detailed documentation with exact specification of Voltage, Ampere etc
  • Full 6 cylinder functionality with option to use some other pins to run 8
  • More dedicated inputs/outputs (2 exhaust temp for example)
  • Flex fuel input (E85) is the main advantage in sensor inputs
  • It has 3 switch inputs, but maybe the Delta handles that with internal configuration?
  • Less resolution (16x20) in ignition and fueling maps, but double maps
  • Details about VVT, Boost and Traction control map resolution

.

There is another important difference between the Delta 800 and the EMU Black:
- The Delta 800 supports four camshafts, two inlet and two for the exhaust.
- The EMU Black only supports two camshafts for the intake, none for the exhaust!

Greeting from Germany

Edited by mgf-martin
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6 minutes ago, mgf-martin said:

There is another important difference between the Delta 800 and the EMU Black:
- The Delta 800 supports four camshafts, two inlet and two for the exhaust.
- The EMU Black only supports two camshafts for the intake, none for the exhaust!

Greeting from Germany

Maybe I am being very slow, but aren’t there 4 camshafts on the 2GR-fe? And if so, then how can the EMU Black work if it only supports 2 camshafts?

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7 minutes ago, Mattmahope said:

Maybe I am being very slow, but aren’t there 4 camshafts on the 2GR-fe? And if so, then how can the EMU Black work if it only supports 2 camshafts?

 

....yes and that is exactly the problem / weak point of the EMU Black!

The exhaust camshafts are not supported with VVT and only run in the basic position, but according to the ECU master there should be no problem.

See the picture

 

Screen Shot 01-20-20 at 08.06 PM.JPG

Edited by mgf-martin
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Howdy guys! sorry I forgot to get back and report my findings.  I was having too much fun with the car! 🙂

A quick summary of the work to my NA S1 Evora ... 

- BOE FAB cold air induction kit

- Larini exhaust headers

- Delta ECU with custom tune 

- Suspension geometry change.

I am very happy with the changes, the car feels great to drive and has stayed very reliable.  I don't know how many miles I've done since I picked it up but I use the car as a daily driver, did a euro road trip to Spain and 2 tracks days and the car has been faultless.  Full OEM functionality is present apart from the tyre pressure monitoring system and the heated mirror button doesn't work as the ECU doesn't have enough inputs.  The fuel efficiency doesn't work (I haven't asked if that was expected) but who uses that anyways?  The predicted range, miles traveled and speed in kph all work fine.  I have not checked the OBD connector plug yet but I assume that works too?  

The car is now producing 313bhp, power and torque have increased though out the rev range and you can feel it low down in the rev range pulling harder but most especially at the top end where the engine keeps pulling well till the redline.  Previously you could feel the engine giving up a little towards the redline but now you want that rev dial needle to just keep going and going and delay the gear change, it really is very addictive.  Car sounds incredible with the induction kit and the exhaust headers, every tunnel I drive through, I just have to drop the clutch and rev the engine.

The drivability of the car is just as good if not better than before as there is more torque lower down the rev range.  Further to that the throttle map has been changed so its a little sharper than before and sport mode makes it sharper still.  To keep good everyday drive-ability gears 1 and 2 have a linear throttle map so its easy to pull away from standstill at the traffic lights.  Then gears 3 to 6 have a steeper profile that feels more responsive and sporty when you are driving.  The initial setting the Delta ECU came with had the same sharp throttle map in all gears, which made it hard to set off slowly from traffic lights as it was very easy to over rev the engine.  I was very impressed by how ES motorsports and the ECU company took my feedback and came up with this solution as its the best of both worlds.  Easy to drive in slow traffic and fun and responsive the out on the open road.  And switch to sport mode and you have the same thing just even more intense!

Traction control seems to work just fine too, ES motorsport said it was programmed it to allow a bit more slip angle in non sport mode.  Again in my opinion I think this setting is an improvement over the factory setting.  Its just a little more slip but makes the dynamics of the car feel more fun and same as before when the traction control does kick in, its not too invasive and reduces the torque just enough to keep the car pointing in the correct direction, there is still a little bit of slip maintained but just reduced by the system so you don't over cook it.  Its this extra bit that makes the car feel better in non sport mode compared the factory setting.

The suspension geometry was changed slightly too, I don't know the exact figures but front end is ever so slightly more pointy and I think rear tow in angle is increased slightly to give more stability in high speed corners.  For me the rear end is big factor, I feel more confident in fast, long corners, I can hold a higher speed, maintain a smoother line through the turn, even adjust the line better mid corner and have more confidence to get back on the power earlier.

I didn't end up getting the cam shaft changes (yet!); ES motorsport tested the cams on a different car and while it produced more power it had no increase in torque and I think the graph profile could have been better.  They wanted to develop the cams for the NA engine a bit more before they are ready for releasing to the public.  I believe they have a cam solution that works on the super charged engine, which produces good results and they have fitted them to a few cars already.  It's just the NA engine cam shafts that they want to develop more and get more performance.  That was a while ago and I need to chase them up to see if there has been any new developments on that front.

Overall I'm very happy with the changes and the support from ES motorsport.  My experience was very good and I would reccomend ES motorsport to anyone not just for performance mods but just general car servicing too.  Feel free to ask away any other questions you may have, happy to help if I can ... 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, electro_boy said:

Howdy guys! sorry I forgot to get back and report my findings.  I was having too much fun with the car! 🙂

A quick summary of the work to my NA S1 Evora ... 

- BOE FAB cold air induction kit

- Larini exhaust headers

- Delta ECU with custom tune 

- Suspension geometry change.

I am very happy with the changes, the car feels great to drive and has stayed very reliable.  I don't know how many miles I've done since I picked it up but I use the car as a daily driver, did a euro road trip to Spain and 2 tracks days and the car has been faultless.  Full OEM functionality is present apart from the tyre pressure monitoring system and the heated mirror button doesn't work as the ECU doesn't have enough inputs.  The fuel efficiency doesn't work (I haven't asked if that was expected) but who uses that anyways?  The predicted range, miles traveled and speed in kph all work fine.  I have not checked the OBD connector plug yet but I assume that works too?  

The car is now producing 313bhp, power and torque have increased though out the rev range and you can feel it low down in the rev range pulling harder but most especially at the top end where the engine keeps pulling well till the redline.  Previously you could feel the engine giving up a little towards the redline but now you want that rev dial needle to just keep going and going and delay the gear change, it really is very addictive.  Car sounds incredible with the induction kit and the exhaust headers, every tunnel I drive through, I just have to drop the clutch and rev the engine.

The drivability of the car is just as good if not better than before as there is more torque lower down the rev range.  Further to that the throttle map has been changed so its a little sharper than before and sport mode makes it sharper still.  To keep good everyday drive-ability gears 1 and 2 have a linear throttle map so its easy to pull away from standstill at the traffic lights.  Then gears 3 to 6 have a steeper profile that feels more responsive and sporty when you are driving.  The initial setting the Delta ECU came with had the same sharp throttle map in all gears, which made it hard to set off slowly from traffic lights as it was very easy to over rev the engine.  I was very impressed by how ES motorsports and the ECU company took my feedback and came up with this solution as its the best of both worlds.  Easy to drive in slow traffic and fun and responsive the out on the open road.  And switch to sport mode and you have the same thing just even more intense!

Traction control seems to work just fine too, ES motorsport said it was programmed it to allow a bit more slip angle in non sport mode.  Again in my opinion I think this setting is an improvement over the factory setting.  Its just a little more slip but makes the dynamics of the car feel more fun and same as before when the traction control does kick in, its not too invasive and reduces the torque just enough to keep the car pointing in the correct direction, there is still a little bit of slip maintained but just reduced by the system so you don't over cook it.  Its this extra bit that makes the car feel better in non sport mode compared the factory setting.

The suspension geometry was changed slightly too, I don't know the exact figures but front end is ever so slightly more pointy and I think rear tow in angle is increased slightly to give more stability in high speed corners.  For me the rear end is big factor, I feel more confident in fast, long corners, I can hold a higher speed, maintain a smoother line through the turn, even adjust the line better mid corner and have more confidence to get back on the power earlier.

I didn't end up getting the cam shaft changes (yet!); ES motorsport tested the cams on a different car and while it produced more power it had no increase in torque and I think the graph profile could have been better.  They wanted to develop the cams for the NA engine a bit more before they are ready for releasing to the public.  I believe they have a cam solution that works on the super charged engine, which produces good results and they have fitted them to a few cars already.  It's just the NA engine cam shafts that they want to develop more and get more performance.  That was a while ago and I need to chase them up to see if there has been any new developments on that front.

Overall I'm very happy with the changes and the support from ES motorsport.  My experience was very good and I would reccomend ES motorsport to anyone not just for performance mods but just general car servicing too.  Feel free to ask away any other questions you may have, happy to help if I can ... 

 

 

 

 

Great write up, thank you!

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@Hangar 111 I'm with AIB insurance, I told them about all the changes including that the ECU has been changed for an aftermarket non factory one.  They didn't ask any further questions apart from listing the modifications.

@Mattmahope no worries, glad to help.

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