Brexit

[C8RKH 6,452]

10 hours ago, PAR said:

The latest development on this subject is the French tax on large companies selling goods online and challenged by the US potentially to the WTO

You need to decide if you are talking about the EU or member states. Not flip flop between the two.

[Barrykearley 6,988]

6 hours ago, C8RKH said:

You need to decide if you are talking about the EU or member states. Not flip flop between the two.

To be fair - if the EU looked at this then they would find I’m sure that what the French are trying to do isn’t legal in respect to EU laws

[Gm77 367]

I’m the last to defend the EU but much of the above isn’t really the EU’s fault and would be tricky for them to address in isolation. We have an international (read global) tax system that largely allocates rights for countries to tax global profits based on having employees on the ground in that country, and what they actually do. Its a principle that goes back to a time well before the internet was even thought of that basically meant if you want to sell something in a country you’d likely need people in that country doing the selling, and elements of a supply chain supporting that sale, also in country. This local substance would give that country a right to tax.
 

With the internet, and improvements in logistics and global trade, there are strong arguments to say that the old system doesn’t work effectively anymore. However, any new system has to be agreed globally, otherwise you end up with governments seeking to tax the same profits which isn’t great for a whole host of reasons. Reaching agreement on such a complicated change is not easy as there will be winners and losers. There is working ongoing on this though (at international not EU level) so watch this space.

And just on UK Corporate Tax, I met with a representative of the Treasury years ago who said they would rather abolish it and recover the lost tax from a small increase in the VAT rate - the tax take on CT isn’t worth the cost in administering it.

[Andyww 1,291]

But the EU make it easy in two ways, firstly single market rules, and second the way in which VAT works in the EU, which the UK has always been lobbying the EU to change since we joined but to no avail. Single market without a single taxation scheme is bound to cause problems.

The point about abolishing CT is a very interesting one. Same could be done with business rates. The biggest problem is if the Tories did this, the left and many mis-informed people in general would go ballistic and social media would explode. Many uninformed people believe that reducing CT is giving "the rich" a tax break. Its actually the opposite because CT is not levied on "the rich" as a company is not a person. If they paid less CT and more income tax for their employees they would be paying more tax as income tax is at a far higher rate. (assuming tax avoidance is not going on of course!).

Contrary to what's usually said on social media, Tory chancellor Osborne did far more than any other previous chancellor to clamp down on tax avoidance. Gordon brown did absolutely nothing. As well as diverted profits tax he ended many of the dodgy Isle of Man and other schemes which the likes of Jimmy Carr were involved in. and he also kept making extra tax raids on the banks.

[C8RKH 6,452]

As ever, informed reading. Thank you @Andyww

[theelanman 511]

I see the politicians are back to their own sweet ways again......

rather than getting on with it they're arguing the toss about nothing and getting offended by the improper use of language

to quote the most namby pamby one I heard........"moderate your language so we can all feel safe going about our jobs"

another one......"brought 'this honourable member' to tears..........the words surrender , capitulation, traitor and treason"

oh get a fikkin grip would you........

hows BREXIT going or are you just trying to delay it a bit longer by wasting time in venting your own personal frustrations about nothing

[Neal H 899]

I don't think it's about Brexit anymore (has it ever been?). Yes, the vast majority in parliament don't want to leave under any circumstances, but this is really about personal agenda's and power.

Labour - Don't give a damn about Brexit, they just want to topple the Tories and will adopt any approach that they think will help achieve that - anti EU - Pro EU - anti 2nd Ref - Pro 2nd Ref - Pro election - anti election. They swap around depending on which way they think the wind is blowing.

Lib-Dems - Their approach was dictated by their devastating result in the 2015 GE. Adopting a clear policy that they knew would make them appeal to the 48% who voted remain gave the potential for them to recover a lot of lost support. They knew they would never appeal to the other 52% but when you're recovering from rock bottom that doesn't matter, it's still a huge step back to potential political credibility. It was a clever strategy which has worked, but like Labour it wasn't driven by a desire to to do what's best for the country, it was to do what's best for the party.

SNP - A one trick pony - Scottish independence. Their sole agenda in parliament is to disrupt the the running of the UK that they don't want to be a part of.

DUP - They want to ensure that nothing interferes with or undermines NI's place in the UK (understandably). Nonetheless, it's still driven by their personal agenda, not the UK's.

Conservatives - Couldn't contain the internal splits on Europe any longer, compounded by May's government trying to be too clever by wasting years pretending to deliver Brexit whilst not really trying and hoping the problem would go away, while Johnson, Gove and their ilk sniffed an opportunity for the top job (who knows what their actual view on Brexit is).

And now they're scared to go back to the electorate. They're not fit for purpose.

[PAR 279]

2 hours ago, Andyww said:

....and second the way in which VAT works in the EU, which the UK has always been...

I think you should explain how you think the VAT works and how the UK would be losing on it.

[Andyww 1,291]

3 minutes ago, PAR said:

I think you should explain how you think the VAT works and how the UK would be losing on it.

I know exactly how it works as I run a business which exports. Its different whether the product is downloadable or physical and whether the customer is a business or individual. Its highly complex and in fact so much so that many small businesses find it impossible to direct-sell downloadable products to EU countries. I am not going to go into a detailed explanation here.

I will just throw this in though:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missing_trader_fraud

[PAR 279]

So you are upset about downloadable products VAT regime (not all VAT) and about organised gangs ripping off European countries including the Uk.

I apologise, I wrongly thought you were saying some countries like Luxembourg  take VAT from the UK which would not have been correct so I was trying to get to the bottom of that.

On issue regarding downloadable products I fear this is not related to brexit/deal/no deal/remain as any form of policing is difficult. All the companies you names are US companies that play aggressively the system and I doubt the government will make this a priority as they negotiate a trade agreement with the US. 

In general, i think European governments are making up fake EU problems to hide away their lack of action on things which is under their remit. Blame others all the time and do nothing yourself seems like a easy path.

[PaulCP 691]

5 hours ago, theelanman said:

I see the politicians are back to their own sweet ways again......

rather than getting on with it they're arguing the toss about nothing and getting offended by the improper use of language

to quote the most namby pamby one I heard........"moderate your language so we can all feel safe going about our jobs"

another one......"brought 'this honourable member' to tears..........the words surrender , capitulation, traitor and treason"

oh get a fikkin grip would you........

hows BREXIT going or are you just trying to delay it a bit longer by wasting time in venting your own personal frustrations about nothing

Worse than kids in the playground. Exchanges in the Commons at times have always been a bit bizarre but this has taken things to a new level which they all should be very much ashamed of. 

I think that every constituency should really evaluate their MPs performance and contributions to this and, for those that are a waste of space (probably the majority), change their nominated representative for the next GE. Although the events of the past 3 years shows that it is time for a big shake up of our political system.

[Sparky 2,863]

Screw this.  We'll be back when it's sorted.

Edited September 26, 2019 by Sparky

[theelanman 511]

Ah you're emigrating.......

[Dan E 1,582]

1 hour ago, Sparky said:

Screw this.  We'll be back when it's sorted.

#annoying

[LotuStuart 91]

#Transportation

[Barrykearley 6,988]

 

[Andyww 1,291]

On 26/09/2019 at 14:08, PAR said:

So you are upset about downloadable products VAT regime (not all VAT) and about organised gangs ripping off European countries including the Uk.

 

What I am most upset about is the large scale tax avoidance on all fronts which the EU have only just got around to a feeble attempt at doing anything about despite it having been going on for 20 years or so and costing the UK and other countries billions.

Even now, they are not targetting any of the companies who use deals set up by Juncker. Guess they cant do that until he goes.

[mayevora 1,278]

By Jesus - 20 years after he touched a leg! 

I personally don’t care if he paid the whole of the Russian female Olympic Shot Put Team to eat caviar off his belly button at tax payers expense,

Just get it on and deliver at the end of October. 

[SFO 194]

Ms Edwards, in her new job, is trying to increase her profile ..

20 years after the alleged incident .. why has she waited so long? It isn’t as if Boris has only just recently had a high profile 

as for Acquiri - scrapping the barrel, pathetic 

[Kimbers 1,849]

On 26/09/2019 at 17:55, Sparky said:

Screw this.  We'll be back when it's sorted.

That does not look like Coach Class to me!!

[red vtec 186]

5 hours ago, mayevora said:

By Jesus - 20 years after he touched a leg! 

I personally don’t care if he paid the whole of the Russian female Olympic Shot Put Team to eat caviar off his belly button at tax payers expense,

Just get it on and deliver at the end of October. 

She is also Robert Pestons other half. Says it all.

[mayevora 1,278]

[Barrykearley 6,988]

[Kimbers 1,849]

EU Diplomats say the Johnson deal is surprisingly better than they thought it would be.

Meanwhile Labour and the Liberals (Won't call them democrats cause theres nothing democratic about them) state they will block it in parliament and ensure it doesn't go through.

So basically, instead of doing whats best for the country they are playing politics to oust someone who will only get back in again at the next General Election. If anyone needs any more proof that the majority of MP's are only out for themselves they have it here.

[C8RKH 6,452]

2 hours ago, Kimbers said:

EU Diplomats say the Johnson deal is surprisingly better than they thought it would be.

Meanwhile Labour and the Liberals (Won't call them democrats cause theres nothing democratic about them) state they will block it in parliament and ensure it doesn't go through.

So basically, instead of doing whats best for the country they are playing politics to oust someone who will only get back in again at the next General Election. If anyone needs any more proof that the majority of MP's are only out for themselves they have it here.

I agree. They really are a shower of nasty little shits.

Bojo could present the best possible deal anyone could ever get and they would still vote it down.

Corbyn is dying on his feet and I doubt he will see the year out as the Fading Party leader. Swinson is riding high on the Remain polls but offers nothing to anyone else.

Bojo is surfing high on the get it done polls. I think he will win in the end, he comes across as trying to get the job done. The lens of news is turning to include talk of him moving substantially his position to get a deal and that will win him the undeciders.

What a total, undemocratic mess though.