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1 hour ago, Bibs said:

Doesn't the driving test still use braking distances from the seventies when some cars had drum brakes still! Have they updated that yet? @mayevora?

Correct - not changed for over 50 years but now described as ‘recommended’ on the basis of thinking distances won’t have changed but a modern car has. Braking distances (imo) are one of the most pointless questions they ask to pupils on theory tests. Tyres, brakes, gradient, weight of vehicle, weather ect ect will obviously all play a part.

Why they still ask ‘what is the overall stopping distance at whatever speed’ and then pupils try and learn it, I’ll never know. Go look out the window and look at the bottom of your garden - how many feet away is it? 100? 105? 112? Does it really matter how many feet away it is? and exactly the same to braking - you can’t count or judge it, in the time it takes whilst braking. 
 

RoSPA gives good training (to those that want it.) The RoSPA Advanced Driving Test is more advanced and harder than the standard Advance Driving Test. It gives a Bronze, Silver or Gold grading as opposed to a Pass/Fail and is also only valid for 12 months.
The big problem with any driver training - it’s only beneficial for somebody that wants to learn. If it’s a punishment (speed awareness ect ect) most come out and don’t improve because they dont want to. Driving is something that nearly all road users think they are good at. If I asked a room full of 100 people ‘who thinks they are a good driver?’ 95 will unfortunately stick their hand up. 

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I actually think the speed limit should be kept at 70 mph - on the basis that most people will always try and push a little more than they are allowed (just look at some lockdown behaviour), I believe

Looks like he wasn’t as clever as he thought!

I reckon that this was only because the old polo neck engineers in Sweden hadn’t realised that Volvo had ever made a car that would go over 112mph...

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On a related matter - seeing its beeb=n discussed here - I thought it was interesting too look at the German Autobahn record.

Firstly, in respect of the UK's 70mph limit - I personally think this is too slow.

It was originally introduced in 1965 - and modern cars are far far safer than then - both in terms of brakes, accident protection, aerodynamics/stability etc.

Personally I feel this should have been raised to 80mph or even 90mph - but environmental concerns, in respect of both emissions and noise, have been raised as reasons for keeping it at 70mph.

You could argue that, if EV's were to become common place, then their reduced noise and emissions would allow this limit to be raised - but realistically I doubt this will happen.

At the stat of this thread, I was of the view that the 'German Driving discipline' would show that their Autobahns were considerably safer than our own crowded motorways. But to my surprise this is not the case https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_Germany

As can be seen:

"In 2018, the autobahn rate of 1.7 fatality per billion traveled kilometer is less secure than both the French one at 1.4 per billion traveled kilometers, and the British one at 1.4 fatalities per vehicle-miles traveled[27]. This means the risk of fatalities per traveled vehicle kilometer is 20% higher in Germany than in France, and near 92% higher than in the UK"

Just goes to show that you shouldn't just assume things 

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Doesn't really explain why the same rate is much higher in the USA with 70mph limits really does it or why it's twice as high in South Korea where the limits are even lower. How come the number of fatalities on German roads has dropped more than 80% since 1970, 5 years after the introduction of the unlimited sections? 

Here's a link you can enjoy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate#cite_note-itf2018-7

Kinda just goes to show that incomplete stats really don't tell much of a story and you shouldn't just rely on them.  

Anyway, back to the guy speeding on the M23 and the other one on the M20 please.

Another tedious back and forth thread you've managed to create, this isn't a good or enjoyable discussion. Any other posts will be removed at my discretion. 

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

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Agree @Bibs these posts always end up taking a turn.

the biggest thing I am always shocked about is that as a learner you can’t drive on the motorway but when you pass your test (involving no motorway testing) you are now free to go anywhere! Then we end up with people sitting in middle lanes till the cows come home, doing sub 70 to join the motorway, driving 2cm from the car in front.

i appreciate it wouldn’t stop idiots like this doing crazy speeds but I am always shocked that They haven’t introduced a second test. First you pass your normal road driving test and then you have lessons and take a motorway test before being able to use any motorways.

would improve the standard of driving no end I’m sure.

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I'm actually struggling to understand the psyche or mindset of someone who thinks it is OK to travel at such speeds on a UK road.

I mean, 200 mph is almost 3 times the speed limit. So, does that mean they would internally justify, in their heads, 90mph in 30? 120mph in a 40?

I get people speed and it's wrong. But how could you ever think that nearly 3 times the speed limit was acceptable? And what is it about the people who buy German cars. Read a bloke had his Merc A45 confiscated - within 2 hours of buying it he was pulled over for, iirc doing 80 in a 40 then found to have no insurance. I mean there's dumb and dumber. But this get was obviously just a dumb selfish twat. 

Instances like this seem to be happening more often and it seems parts of society are all about me, me and me and to hell with anyone else.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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2 hours ago, BatMobile said:

 

the biggest thing I am always shocked about is that as a learner you can’t drive on the motorway but when you pass your test (involving no motorway testing)  First you pass your normal road driving test and then you have lessons and take a motorway test before being able to use any motorways

would improve the standard of driving no end I’m sure.

All Provisional License holders are now given some Motorway Tuition where a Motorway is accessible. Not too many in Norfolk or Cornwall - Motorway is not part of the Driving Test for that reason but Driving Instructors (not school of Mum and Dad) are allowed. Amazing the amount of people who didn’t see this legislation change two years ago and even more amazing school of Mum and Dad who think they are allowed to supervise whilst using a mobile phone. 

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I'm surprised to hear learners weren't allowed on motorways till recently. I often hear of people who are afraid to drive on motorways, but I don't get it. Surely there's no real risk? Granted, the speeds are higher, so if something does go wrong, the results are likely to be more severe. In that respect it's a good idea to make sure the learner has some experience before being allowed on a motorway. So if he does make an error, he'll have a better chance of correcting it before it really goes wrong.

But on the other hand, most accidents happen at junctions, roundabouts, traffic lights etc or involve cyclist or pedestrians. You get none of those on a motorway. You don't even have oncoming traffic, all you have to do is stay in lane and drive at an appropriate speed (that's me back on topic :) ). Unless you encounter heavy traffic, you wont even have to change gears. Not too hard really, as long as you have some basic driving skills. Yet I know of people who have been driving for 10s of years, but refuse to take a motorway. Instead they'll take (long) detours, often passing several known dangerous junctions etc because it makes them feel safer. Granted, belgian motorways have a lot more on and off ramps, and those are often poorly designed with the radius changing halfway through the turn etc. But still, take it slow on the ramps and there's nothing to worry about. You can comfortably sit in the slow lane, no need to overtake if you don't want to, you'll still be faster and less at risk than taking normal roads. So why are motorways seen as dangerous? I really don't get it (as evidenced by my rant 😛 ).

Filip

I have made many mistakes in my life. Buying a multiple Lotus is not one of them.

 

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20 hours ago, mayevora said:

All Provisional License holders are now given some Motorway Tuition where a Motorway is accessible. Not too many in Norfolk or Cornwall - Motorway is not part of the Driving Test for that reason but Driving Instructors (not school of Mum and Dad) are allowed. Amazing the amount of people who didn’t see this legislation change two years ago and even more amazing school of Mum and Dad who think they are allowed to supervise whilst using a mobile phone. 

I was stunned when my eldest told me she had gone on the motorway on one of her lessons - I never knew they could. A brilliant idea imho 👍

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Only here once

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I think half the problem is that cars are so fast these days that getting to the point where you feel you are challenging them almost inevitably means going over the speed limit. Im not talking about motorways here, Im talking about normal A and B roads at the national speed limit.

We need a different class of vehicle to enjoy driving. In the good old days you could drift a Morris Minor around a roundabout at 25 mph and it was fantastic fun. In a modern car you'd have to be going twice as fast.

What Im saying in a rambling kind of way is that you can have great fun at lower speeds. How much fun is go-karting in a little, slow hire-kart? 

Or a cyclekarts that can only do 45mph flat out? Immense fun.....

We all need to re-calibrate and enjoy cars built for fun, not speed, even if they are slower than an everyday shopping car....

 

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If 200mph is totally unsafe and insane, then what speed is safe? Everyone here has a car capable of more than double the National  speed limit, which is ironic.

Margate Exotics.

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We did have a few years, back in the 50s/60s where we didn’t have any speed limits on our UK Motorways (granted we didn’t have many of them lol) When the 70mph was introduced it was funnily enough supposed a temporary measure and reviewed. Like we’ve said before cars have changed unrecognisably but the human brain hasn’t - the 70mph speed limits were and are still set up so the worst denomination of road user is able to cope with that limit. Unfortunately (and obviously) you can’t have max speed 50mph for new drivers and anyone over 80 and the rest of us a different limit. So right now (and personally don’t agree with it) 70mph is deemed the safe limit in the U.K. 😊

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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1 hour ago, Chillidoggy said:

Everyone here has a car capable of more than double the National  speed limit, which is ironic.

Now now, there you again, forgetting about those members with classic Lotus, Elite, Elan, Elite/Eclat/Excel and non-turbo Esprit as well as the Elise. 😉

I fully concur with Dave above, we need to be able to have fun driving at more reasonable speeds. Something Lotus has always been good at, with cars designed for handling and not outright speed (like the Audi). Which is also why I prefer my Elan +2 (or Excel) for classic car runs, great fun on a spirited drive without the excessive speeds my Esprit SE will do when pushed. I can only imagine it's even more effortless in the Evora, especially the later, powerful models.

Filip

I have made many mistakes in my life. Buying a multiple Lotus is not one of them.

 

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6 hours ago, dclare said:

I think half the problem is that cars are so fast these days that getting to the point where you feel you are challenging them almost inevitably means going over the speed limit. Im not talking about motorways here, Im talking about normal A and B roads at the national speed limit.

We need a different class of vehicle to enjoy driving. In the good old days you could drift a Morris Minor around a roundabout at 25 mph and it was fantastic fun. In a modern car you'd have to be going twice as fast.

What Im saying in a rambling kind of way is that you can have great fun at lower speeds. How much fun is go-karting in a little, slow hire-kart? 

Or a cyclekarts that can only do 45mph flat out? Immense fun.....

We all need to re-calibrate and enjoy cars built for fun, not speed, even if they are slower than an everyday shopping car....

 

Lotus Elise.  Other than the drifting roundabouts at 25mph, it fulfills all of the above.  Its the best fun you can have under 60mph IMO, in fact I have often thought of moving the Evora on and getting another, especially with the weather as it has been recently.

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So that's what is meant by 'drive it like you stole it'. 😀

Not too clever posting a video of it!

I have made many mistakes in my life. Buying a multiple Lotus is not one of them.

 

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Are the people they arrested the owners of the car or the theifs

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hindsight: the science that is never wrong

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