free hit
counters
Where do you stand on NHS & Emergency Service Pay Freeze/Poor Rise - General Chat - The Lotus Forums #ForTheOwners Jump to content


Where do you stand on NHS & Emergency Service Pay Freeze/Poor Rise


Kimbers

Where do you stand on the whole 1% pay rise for Nurses and Freeze for Police, Ambo and Fire  

33 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

Here's your starter for one!

I am a little in the know so feel I can comment and explain this a little.

Nurses/NHS workers had no rise for 5 years with inflation from 2-3% so lost around 12-15% of their wages. They then had 5% over 3 years which again was a real life cut in wages. Now they are being offered 1% and see this as an insult. Many, like my wife, are at a level where they won't get a rise at all as they aren't increasing the "Earning brackets". However what that means is those who have been there the longest won't be getting rises. Many are naturally worried about staff retention at a time Nurses are needed more than ever. I know my wife has now had enough and like many Nurses who have been in there jobs for a long time see's this as the final nail in the coffin at a time when they are needed most. Like many she won't leave the profession till the COVID emergency is over with. But after she will be leaving. 

Starting wages for the likes of Police is £20k a year where I live. They haven't had rises for a long time like NHA workers and to do their job for the early £20k's wages is rediculous. What you also don't see is that "Experience" or "Level increases" (so going from grade 1 trainee to 2 "Probationer" to 3 "Independent" and so on have also been cut so where an experienced Officer could max "levels" out in 7 years its now 9 or even 12. So they earn less for longer. Its a dangerous job with long shift work hours, stress, violence and mentally draining. During COVID Police have had to enforce laws that no one has ever seen before and react according to instructions from Home Office. Making them an object of attack and criticism.

Ambo, we all know what they have been doing but did you know that Many Fire crews have been working Ambulance during the various lockdowns? With Fire calls down hugely (People are at home so home and work fires are down and there are very few Road Collisions) Many of the Fire Crews Offered to both drive and work on ambulances. They still are!

My thoughts are obvious. These professions should be paid more in the first place so cutting their wages in real terms with pay freezes and under inflation rises makes them even worse. retention in the NHS, ambo and Police is a major issue. 

What are your thoughts?

Possibly save your life. Check out this website.
http://everyman-campaign.org/

 

Distributor for 'Every Male' grooming products. (Discounts for any TLF members hairier than I am!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Upgrade today to remove Google ads and support TLF.
  • Gold FFM
8 minutes ago, Bazza 907 said:

They are underpaid for what they do. End of.

I do disagree for the categories I mentioned.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM

2 different questions here. 
 

Is pay in the NHS right?
Should any public sector get pay rises against the general job market. 
 

Annual pay rises are inflationary, so bumping them up a bit never solves the underlying issue. You have to have the right salaries and then maintain an appropriate annual increase. I tend to agree with @C8RKHhere except, Unskilled labour which happens to be in a hospital should be rewarded in line with standard rates. I don’t subscribe to a hospital cleaner being paid more than a supermarket cleaner/worker etc, who will all be on pretty much minimum wage. 
 

The issue is the same in private sector. Long serving staff get small increments, new staff get paid more, so people have to move about to earn the “correct” pay, or stand out so much that they get “salary corrections” outside of the pay round. 
 

I also believe in a salary for a role, this is the only fair way. So with a different lens, someone who doesn’t get a pay rise because they are at the top of their band is already better off than those who do get a pay rise. I have to balance my overall pay rise budget to get to an overall figure, so clearly those lesser paid staff will (all things being equal) get a bigger rise than those paid more. Of course I have a zero budget this year. 

Ps. Pay more because we need them right now. Not sure. They should have the right pay I absolutely agree, but this is different from rewarding them for their current efforts. Get the pay right, then pay them the overtime they work and a bonus. That is how to provide short term reward, incentive. 

  • Like 2

A Lotus is for driving, pork is for breakfast.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can certainly understand the consternation from NHS workers’ side. The Government and Public have just spent the past 12 months singing their praises as national heroes. Then this 1% pay increase gets floated, having seen great swathes of the population being paid up to £2500 per month by the Government for doing f**k all for the best part of 18 months. I would be livid.

Let’s hope the don’t go on a vaccination strike.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Stop paying somuch to agencies for their nhs workers

  • Like 1
  • Love 1

hindsight: the science that is never wrong

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, pete said:

Stop paying somuch to agencies for their nhs workers

Indeed, but they need the staff because they are so short and the agencies take a cut as well so they look even more expensive than they are!

On that note Wendy could get a 25% pay rise for going agency but they are 0 hour contracts AND many agency nurses I know sometimes go for weeks without any work or just a day here or there. Her best bet is private Nursing but that isn't her, she's there for the care aspect not the money. 

Possibly save your life. Check out this website.
http://everyman-campaign.org/

 

Distributor for 'Every Male' grooming products. (Discounts for any TLF members hairier than I am!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
12 minutes ago, Kimbers said:

Indeed, but they need the staff because they are so short and the agencies take a cut as well so they look even more expensive than they are!

On that note Wendy could get a 25% pay rise for going agency but they are 0 hour contracts AND many agency nurses I know sometimes go for weeks without any work or just a day here or there. Her best bet is private Nursing but that isn't her, she's there for the care aspect not the money. 

It's not just nurses @ Kimbers.  The real issue is the silly amounts of money that are paid to Locum's. That is where there is huge waste to be honest.

I love the NHS, but to fix the issues over pay, you need to make it a more efficient and affordable service. And unfortunately those with their snouts deep into the golden snout, like GP's, Consultants etc will never allow the efficiencies as it keeps them all in a very nice lifestyle.  Of course we need to get rid of the useless managers, and management consultants too.  Then, there will probably be enough in the kitty to actually make the jobs financially rewarding for all in the NHS.

 

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
Posted (edited)

Has anyone actually looked at nurses pay banding. It’s not hidden from anyone - least of all those whom chose it as a career path.

if you don’t like the pay - don’t train to be a nurse. 

Edited by Barrykearley
  • Like 1

Only here once

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Barrykearley said:

Has anyone actually looked at nurses pay banding. It’s not hidden from anyone - least of all those whom chose it as a career path.

if you don’t like the pay - don’t train to be a nurse. 

Some chose to take the career path many years ago and obviously did look at the pay band and 30 years ago it looked different than it does today but for sure they looked at other things as well, like how can I help people in need. Not one of your best replies Barry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM

I get fed up of listening to unions and public sector workers bitching and moaning about their guaranteed secure jobs. If they don’t like it - get out and do something else. 

  • Like 1

Only here once

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM

Absolutely @910Esprit - that’s spot on. 
 

doesn’t fit with the leftie modern day moaning whinging narrative. By Christ had they given them 20% pay rise they would have been moaning it’s not enough and what about the bin men. At some point the cold hard reality will sink in.

And as for teachers.... well ain’t they hard done by 😳

Only here once

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Barrykearley said:

I get fed up of listening to unions and public sector workers bitching and moaning about their guaranteed secure jobs. If they don’t like it - get out and do something else. 

Sadly a lot decide it’s a profession they can not deal with for numerous reason not just financial, most mental health and they do leave and do something else. That’s way we depend on a workforce from the European Union and further afield something else i am sure you do you not agree with. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM

Might help

Average UK pay = £29k

Minimum wage c£15k

Nurse newly qualified = £24k 

2-4 years £26-30k

7 years £31-38k

 

 

 

  • Like 1
  • Love 1

A Lotus is for driving, pork is for breakfast.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
17 minutes ago, scotty435 said:

That’s way we depend on a workforce from the European Union and further afield something else i am sure you do you not agree with. 

We depend on migrant workers due to our own governments and opposition parties complete laziness. Successive governments of all colours find it far simpler to import labour than to train our own people. Now is a great time - 5% unemployed and no doubt the labour benches will soon be crying about the lost opportunities for those most vulnerable kids leaving school. Maybe it’s time we invested in the uk people.

keep reading the tosh spouted in the Guardian 

Only here once

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Colin P said:

Might help

Average UK pay = £29k

Minimum wage c£15k

Nurse newly qualified = £24k 

2-4 years £26-30k

7 years £31-38k

 

 

 

Sure we did not class them as Average when the nation clapped for them earlier last year at the start of the pandemic and now after a year of what they have had to go through in what can only be described as probably being worst profession to be in. So does your comment help probably not. Be nice if some people show some compassion.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
3 hours ago, scotty435 said:

So does your comment help probably not. Be nice if some people show some compassion.

My comment merely quoted facts, no opinion. Views on here as to whether or not nhs wages are fair can only be informed if the actual wages and comparisons are available. Therefore the post should help with perspective.

Exactly where did I say they were average? It’s a benchmark. I merely quoted minimum wage, average wage and nhs wage from which people can make their own judgement as where the wages sit.

Compassion is not relevant in setting a wage. The question of correct salary is NOT short term, or have they been paid enough over the last year because it’s been really shit, but is a question of “in normal circumstances” are they paid enough. Compassion therefore doesn’t come into it.

That is not to say that their wage is fair or not. This question is not related in any way to COVID or the last 12 months. COVID and fair pay discussions should not be conjoined. 

Please do not interpret a mere statement of facts as a suggestion that nurses are “average” I quite clearly have not made that assertion and wouldn’t seeing as I don’t see that as the case. But a measure of a fair wage must always be taken in context of an “average” wage as a benchmark. 

So please read a post properly, don’t assume, and be sure of your facts before you tell someone that they have no compassion. 
 

  • Like 2

A Lotus is for driving, pork is for breakfast.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Kimbers said:

On that note Wendy could get a 25% pay rise for going agency but they are 0 hour contracts AND many agency nurses I know sometimes go for weeks without any work or just a day here or there.

That is the risk of self employment isnt it.    I have only ever been SE and have had week when I earnt 0 and some when I did more than alright.   Doesnt suit everybody. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...