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any boiler installers in ??


windymiller

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  • Gold FFM

so poor dads oil boiler gone kaput, currently it is in the cellar of the house and of course all pipework oil feeds electrics etc terminate there too, so hes had two guys round both of whom have advocated re siting the boiler outside ?? as a "better" option better for who i wonder as surely thats gona cost over 1k extra to re route pipes and elec etc and put in a new concrete pad ? my boulter boiler is in my integral garage with a flue terminating through the wall i wudnt contemplate moving it outside ? cant fathom the rational 

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we had a gas boiler at one of previous houses, I was always worried about the pipe to/from and in the garage, am sure I used to hear ice going round in very cold weather... I suppose it was an old installation so may not have been well insulated.

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  • Gold FFM

the external boiler will no doubt be as effecient as an internal like for like model but why put it outside when your not trying to free up space ? (cellar is not full height and therefore cudnt be used as a room) all pipes are there ready for a straight swap ??

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19 minutes ago, pete said:

Or switch to lpg

Or heat pumps, don't know much about these but the local council has a scheme to install them if houses are not on mains gas/in certain benefit categories etc. Government is pushing greener alternatives, like heat pumps . but we know how good the government are when advising their population what to do - eg diesel cars are better...

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  • Gold FFM
49 minutes ago, windymiller said:

so poor dads oil boiler gone kaput, currently it is in the cellar of the house and of course all pipework oil feeds electrics etc terminate there too, so hes had two guys round both of whom have advocated re siting the boiler outside ?? as a "better" option better for who i wonder as surely thats gona cost over 1k extra to re route pipes and elec etc and put in a new concrete pad ? my boulter boiler is in my integral garage with a flue terminating through the wall i wudnt contemplate moving it outside ? cant fathom the rational 

One of the benefits of having the boiler outside would be reduced risk of carbon monoxide/fumes, leakage of the fuel and potential fire risk. However, I would have thought that unless there were issues with building control/regs you can just tell them to put the new one in the position of the old one. In that instance, the customer would be right!  Good luck.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • Gold FFM

even if not law id advocate carbon monoxide and smoke det, the boiler has been there for approx 35 years !!! hes being told its cheaper to instal new one outside but thats impossible and makes me think hes being stichted up

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  • Gold FFM
37 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

Or heat pumps, don't know much about these but the local council has a scheme to install them if houses are not on mains gas/in certain benefit categories etc. Government is pushing greener alternatives, like heat pumps . but we know how good the government are when advising their population what to do - eg diesel cars are better...

Brother just had one installed. We will need a new boiler before I do the kitchen and was considering one, but it seems that the water temperatures are that much lower that you need bigger pipework (like 28mm) and bigger radiators - so a new boiler becomes rip out the whole system and replace.

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Blessed with the competence to be a slave to the incapable.

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  • Gold FFM
35 minutes ago, Colin P said:

Brother just had one installed. We will need a new boiler before I do the kitchen and was considering one, but it seems that the water temperatures are that much lower that you need bigger pipework (like 28mm) and bigger radiators - so a new boiler becomes rip out the whole system and replace.

I believe pipes can stay the same, but it is the radiator sizes that need to increase - due to the heat output being lower per sqm etc.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • Gold FFM

@C8RKHI think that depends upon how much 15mm pipework there is. I believe that you may get away with it if most pipework is 22mm, but if you have a lot of 15mm (which my brother did and I know I do) then you can't circulate sufficient quantities of water.

Besides, I just spent 4K in the last 12 months on new radiators....

Blessed with the competence to be a slave to the incapable.

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23 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

I believe pipes can stay the same, but it is the radiator sizes that need to increase - due to the heat output being lower per sqm etc.

I had read somewhere about having larger radiators, but had not seen anything about the pipework - imagine the amount of work having to change any screeded underfloor heating pipes with larger ones.

We live in a bungalow so the pipes are mainly under the suspended wooden floor so would be slightly easier to access.

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  • Gold FFM
25 minutes ago, Colin P said:

@C8RKHI think that depends upon how much 15mm pipework there is. I believe that you may get away with it if most pipework is 22mm, but if you have a lot of 15mm (which my brother did and I know I do) then you can't circulate sufficient quantities of water.

Besides, I just spent 4K in the last 12 months on new radiators....

What's the cost of a heat pump (air source?)  Last time I looked it was £15k for my house fully installed etc. With running it, it would take 15 years to pay that back, oh, and the life of the heat pump, yup, you guessed it, 15 years!  So I was out. Still have my 24 year old combi oil boiler, that was specificed way too large for my house, so has never been under stress and has been reliable (apart from the biannual replacement of the diverter valve that sticks - TADTS) and will continue to run for another 10 years or so.  Cost to change versus payback just has not been there for me. Maybe things will change in the future.

 

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • Gold FFM

@C8RKH I didn't ask him, but the number my Dad mentioned was a bit more than that, but it was the whole system, so pipes, rads the lot. With the whole of downstairs buried in the concrete floor there I lost interest the minute replacing the pipes was mentioned.

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Blessed with the competence to be a slave to the incapable.

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  • Gold FFM

If I were to hazard a guess - this is down to building regs and flue costs.  Like for like swap out shouldn’t be an issue.

Only here once

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  • Gold FFM
59 minutes ago, Colin P said:

@C8RKH I didn't ask him, but the number my Dad mentioned was a bit more than that, but it was the whole system, so pipes, rads the lot. With the whole of downstairs buried in the concrete floor there I lost interest the minute replacing the pipes was mentioned.

That £15k was the heat pump and install - not radiators and pipes. I've just checked, mine are 15mm pipes mainly around the radiator ring I ain't ripping up my floors for anyone right now, the cost for that with new pipes and radiators would be £25k I reckon. That's 15 years worth of oil easy.

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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The larger the heat pump and the larger the pipe run the bigger the pipe needs to be.

A 5kw pump needs 22mm pipe but a 16 kw needs 35mm piping

hindsight: the science that is never wrong

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  • Gold FFM

I'll stick with oil then! :)

 

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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16 hours ago, C8RKH said:

radiators would be £25k I reckon. That's 15 years worth of oil easy.

I think we get round about £400 pa of oil ie around 800 litres each year, but we do live in sunny Devon,,,, and so it is not really running for many months - we also have a log burner and loads of logs/trees ..

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  • Gold FFM
7 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

I think we get round about £400 pa of oil ie around 800 litres each year, but we do live in sunny Devon,,,, and so it is not really running for many months - we also have a log burner and loads of logs/trees ..

I'm around 1500-1800 litres depending on the snow levels and whether the wind is coming from the North East or not!   It's like with EV's (which are getting better) the math doesn't support the justification for change from a financial point of view.  And ultimately that is were renewables are falling down, so far, they have only really been viable whilst being subsidised heavily.  Great for the small number of people who benefit from the subsidies, until you realise that 30% of the current typical electricity bill goes to the cost of renewable subsidy schemes and other "policies" that are therefore paid by EVERYONE who uses electricity. COVID believe it or not escalated the cost of these subsidies which is now almost £10.5bn per annum!!!  That's £10.5bn, per annum, split across everyone's electricity bill!

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

snow levels

what snow - we had a bit a few years ago, a lorry got stuck outside and the A30 was closed. 

Anyone on here gone for a ground source heat pump, we have some land so it might be feasible but looks  like it is not easy.

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  • Gold FFM
23 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

what snow - we had a bit a few years ago, a lorry got stuck outside and the A30 was closed. 

Anyone on here gone for a ground source heat pump, we have some land so it might be feasible but looks  like it is not easy.

GS is more expensive again I believe.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • Gold FFM

Aye, but once in isn't it pretty much free?

Blessed with the competence to be a slave to the incapable.

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Just having aircon/heating installed in the cattery. Uses an air source heat pump. 

Also have an air source heat pump to heat the water in the swimming pool.

Any type of heat pump won't be free as they use electricity to operate - if you have solar panels then that can offset but you are unlikely to generate the power needed all the time.

Anyone thought of the electricity load? If you have a car charger and a heat pump you are going to take a fair load. Car charger (around 7kW) heat pump (around 13kW)

So 21kW if both operate together (in an evening??) Working on 4amps per kW (I know that is overly simplistic and that the UK is now 230V although in our house it is normally at 250V) then you would be at 84amps. Most domestic installations are 100amps max - ours is only a 60amp main fuse.

Me thinks that the costs are going to mount up with all the necessary alterations required apart from the radiators/pipes etc.

Dave - 2000 Sport 350
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  • Gold FFM
48 minutes ago, Colin P said:

Aye, but once in isn't it pretty much free?

Nope - you have to pay for the electricity it uses, unless you have free electricity.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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