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So are the driver's rubbish where you live?


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6 hours ago, mayevora said:

Anyone been to India?

Yep - And driven(tuk-tuk), ridden (Enfield Bullet), driven steam train (around marshalling yard only) - it's brilliant fun, can highly recommend it as long as the vehicles aren't yours.

If you really want to be scared take a local Tata bus ride around the valleys of Nepal. Where possible we used to ride on the roof with the luggage so we could jump off should it go over (which is more common than you would think).

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8 hours ago, C8RKH said:

 Part of the problem is that cars are becoming lack lounges on wheels with big screens and lots of other distractions which, coupled with them getting bigger, is just making people feel like they are invincible!

THIS! I was going to post a similar reply to drivers on autopilot. There is so little to do and even less feeling/connection with the road in modern cars, and at the same time people are feeling the need to be busy and 'connected' all the time, so actually driving almost becomes a nuisance and the less attention paid to it the better it would seem.

Now compare that to driving a Lotus or classic car, where you want and have to be in control all the time, and actually enjoy it because it can make a rewarding trip out of even a boring commute.

 

5 hours ago, C8RKH said:

The best thing about India is when you are on a dual carriageway and you see four lanes of traffic in each direction :)   :driving:

That reminds me of our first trip to Russia. After spending many hours at the border with Finland, we finally set off as darkness was falling. It was the major road towards St Petes, 1 lane each way, no division and an unpaved shoulder each side. We were a convoy of 3 Land Rovers, one with a loaded car trailer so taking it easy. Little surprise the locals started overtaking us. Just as they were doing with the truck coming the other way. Quite shocking! Then we saw the truck move to the shoulder, the overtaking cars moving to the right accordingly, so did the same on our side, and somehow everything worked out and nobody seemed to slow down. When traffic slowed closer to the city that same shoulder was used to undertake the cues. After that we started referring to the shoulder as a general purpose lane, adjusted our driving style accordingly and generally had a lot of fun out there. 😎 

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I have made many mistakes in my life. Buying a multiple Lotus is not one of them.

 

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5 hours ago, Escape said:

THIS! I was going to post a similar reply to drivers on autopilot. There is so little to do and even less feeling/connection with the road in modern cars, and at the same time people are feeling the need to be busy and 'connected' all the time, so actually driving almost becomes a nuisance and the less attention paid to it the better it would seem.

Even the wife complains when her newest RR does things on it own, like the lights going on or off without her doing anything. So many times needing to faff about with the touchscreen to get at the settings for seats/fans/stop start etc. Said we should go back to an earlier version that did not do these things. 

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10 hours ago, Elite 4.9 said:

 

So IMHO, laws aren't the answer. but education and making it more difficult to get your drivers license would be a good start.

It should be more difficult to get ones driving license than it takes to pull out your prize from a Crackerjacks box as anyone can get one. 

Expose young people going through drivers training to the results from doing stupid things while driving. I mean, for instance, take them to the prisons to see the drunks who killed another person while drunk. Expose them to people in hospitals whose lives are now nearly ruined by texting and drinking. First hand knowledge is always better for burning important things in your mind.

Well said. 👍

The problem with a single Test at age 17 (U.K.) if you stay fit healthy and well you could still be driving 80 odd years after that original test on you same license. I can’t see why a retest every 10 years (to coincide with driving license renewal) isn’t mandatory (my opinion)

I wouldn’t mind betting that if a poll was set even here on a motoring forum that the majority would prefer not to retest for any number of reasons. (Prove me wrong someone please) 

Then there would most likely be a completely different answer if the same question was asked, but stating that only an individual who passes their test after, for example January 2023 would have to resit and wouldn’t apply retrospectively to existing license holders - everyone would agree. 

Question @Elite 4.9
Why a 3 strikes and you are out rule on Drink Driving? - Make it just 1 and a custodial sentence (as a deterrent) and would surely cut the number of offences in half.

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Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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There is absolutely no need for blanket re-testing. The courts have the power to impose a re-test to any individual who clearly fails to observe the rules of the road.

You only have to think about the volumes of traffic on the roads Vs the number of accidents to see blanket re-testing would be a waste of time and money. There are far bigger and more urgent issues to fix in society.

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Trying to prove a point....?

Car crashes through Sainsbury's supermarket window

/...t said an investigation was ongoing but initial CCTV inquiries showed a "poor standard of driving" in the car park......

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-59717991

Car crashes into supermarket in Derby

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1 hour ago, tim_marra said:

There is absolutely no need for blanket re-testing. The courts have the power to impose a re-test to any individual who clearly fails to observe the rules of the road.

You only have to think about the volumes of traffic on the roads Vs the number of accidents to see blanket re-testing would be a waste of time and money. There are far bigger and more urgent issues to fix in society.

🎣 So that’s 1 against already 🤣

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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5 hours ago, mayevora said:

Well said. 👍

The problem with a single Test at age 17 (U.K.) if you stay fit healthy and well you could still be driving 80 odd years after that original test on you same license. I can’t see why a retest every 10 years (to coincide with driving license renewal) isn’t mandatory (my opinion)

I wouldn’t mind betting that if a poll was set even here on a motoring forum that the majority would prefer not to retest for any number of reasons. (Prove me wrong someone please) 

Then there would most likely be a completely different answer if the same question was asked, but stating that only an individual who passes their test after, for example January 2023 would have to resit and wouldn’t apply retrospectively to existing license holders - everyone would agree. 

Question @Elite 4.9
Why a 3 strikes and you are out rule on Drink Driving? - Make it just 1 and a custodial sentence (as a deterrent) and would surely cut the number of offences in half.

yeah well, I didn't make the rule and you just can't stop people from doing what they do even if they are breaking the law. Many just don't care one bit. Too much booze.

Years ago, I visited a gal in BC just across the boarder from Washington state where I live, and the cops would, on a regular basis, put up a road block and check each driver to see if he had been drinking. This of course was done late in the evenings and nearly always on the weekends when more drunks are out driving.

I am sure it was effective at stopping people from drinking and driving but it would not stop all of them. A problem which more than likely will never get totally fixed until you have your car drive you home all by itself which they are building right now.

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If they did the re-testing, then I think it should be a different test, meaning we take the initial test as a "you're OK to be let loose but you've got a lot to learn" and the subsequent ones then look from a "Have you moved from a capable novice to competent and so not need further instruction". so those who would struggle to pass that basic test if had to redo it, they'd be the ones where it then identifies they need more instruction & supervision. Rather ,like the driver (unknown age, gender, experience) who stalled on a hill start (OK, we can all do that occasionally), seemed to struggle to keep within the lane, joined the roundabout at a much slower speed than the vehicles which he/she pulled in front of, joined the roundabout by going toward the centre then slowed to do an almost 90deg turn to follow the lane round it).

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On 17/12/2021 at 15:36, Bibs said:

This is in the Highway Code from Jan 29 next year :huh:

46094807-10319707-This_MailOnline_graphi

Its interesting what we think we know and dont know about driving and the rules of the road.  I was shocked on the speed awareness course that I did at just how little most of the people in the room knew.  Clearly I was no better as I was required to be there too.  And this "rule change" is another shock.   I thought the give way when turning rule was already there.  Indeed I thought that that was the meaning of the single dotted line across the road.  I know of course that the double dotted line is THE give way line.  But all road markings have a meaning, they aren't just there to mark the edges and joins.  I understood that a dotted line should't be crossed until safe to do so whether that be a lane marker a road junction a central reserve or whatever - so basically pay attention to it and only proceed when its clear.

I would also favour further compulsory training.  Since my lessons/test at 17 I've done skid pan training and a couple of track schools.  Also done Motorcycling CBT, Full license and "road rider" courses, plus both the Kieth Code  and Ron Haslam track schools, and what used to be HGV (now LGV C and C+E  - passed the C failed the C+E).  So I've been through the process a few times and learnt plenty of stuff on every occasion.  "Passing a test" has always appeared to me to be poorly set up - I've seen some of my training as just how to pass the test, not how to drive, and the test has reflected that, which cheapens it in my view.  Training should be and often is real world and really useful.  Make people sit through that...but dont necessarily put them through the unnecessary stress of a pass/fail situation.  On the speed awareness course there was no test, but most of the people there must have learnt something from it and I bet they were better informed when they left than when they started.  Moot point if it made them a better driver of course.  But we all make mistakes - I see it in my own driving on just about every journey and it makes me cringe - use it goad me into trying to get better.  Not all poor driving is done by muppets - we all make mistakes.

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Loving Lionel and Eleanor......missing Charlie and Sonny

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12 hours ago, andydclements said:

If they did the re-testing, then I think it should be a different test, meaning we take the initial test as a "you're OK to be let loose but you've got a lot to learn" and the subsequent ones then look from a "Have you moved from a capable novice to competent and so not need further instruction". so those who would struggle to pass that basic test if had to redo it, they'd be the ones where it then identifies they need more instruction & supervision. Rather ,like the driver (unknown age, gender, experience) who stalled on a hill start (OK, we can all do that occasionally), seemed to struggle to keep within the lane, joined the roundabout at a much slower speed than the vehicles which he/she pulled in front of, joined the roundabout by going toward the centre then slowed to do an almost 90deg turn to follow the lane round it).

This is why I did the advanced driving test - it tests to see if you have progressed and mine involved an hour long driving test on all types of road with an ex police driving instructor. When I took it they had just made the accompanying commentary an option.

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Dave - 2000 Sport 350
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Nice one Dave. Thats the RoSPA one as opposed to the IAM one then. Better marking/grading system. 👍😊

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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I've not done the advanced driving course/test as I was put off by what was the then prescribed steering method (feeding through the hands) which I think is daft and dangerously slow) - dont know if that's changed in recent years.

... and the fact that my sister-in-law took and passed the IAM course and is/was in my view very marginal about whether she should be allowed on the road at all.  No feel or fine control of the car, does everything by wrote.  But she was considered by at least one IAM instructor an "advanced" driver, seems incredible to me... 

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Loving Lionel and Eleanor......missing Charlie and Sonny

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20 minutes ago, oneshot said:

No the IAM one.

That only changed about 5 years back. The Commentary wasn’t in the older one.

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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1 hour ago, MPx said:

 

... and the fact that my sister-in-law took and passed the IAM course and is/was in my view very marginal about whether she should be allowed on the road at all. 

Lol. That doesn’t surprise too much Mike. Doing some advanced Test training a few years ago I advised a lady (after a number of hours) not to take it, but she went ahead, did it and still attained a Bronze. 


 

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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5 minutes ago, mayevora said:

few years ago I advised a lady (after a number of hours)

not the missus ?

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19 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

not the missus ?

Lol. No. She’d definitely have it revoked 🤣

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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With an IAM assessment - did not think they could revoke - more a guidance course than a full driving test sort of thing?

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I’m joking Keith. The IAM can’t be and you have for life. The ROSPA advanced is only valid for 12 months anyway and you then need to redo it every year.

I was talking about a normal L test. She’s definitely one of the ones who wouldn’t pass again lol.

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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AOL reported the highway 'changes' on today's news. The comments certainly are anti cyclists, and many sound like my wife's.

https://www.aol.co.uk/news/highway-code-rule-change-giving-194756472.html

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I remember a few years ago I posted about when I was working underneath my Esprit on my driveway and a teenage girl crashed in to my other (parked) car. She was to busy checking Fudbook or whatever to watch the road. If she was just a few seconds earlier she would have missed the parked car and hit the Esprit instead, knocking it off it's four stands and landing on top of me. That was a "lucky" one for sure.

I've said this before, a defensive driving course taught me one thing - treat EVERY SINGLE DRIVER as an utter moron because when they do something stupid you won't be surprised and can be prepared. It's exhausting though and that course ruined driving for quite a long time!

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