To swap, or not to swap?

[yeti]

Hi,

All Lotus purists - look away now!

I'm looking into replacing my S3 NA engine for something a bit more reliable. However, to keep cost down and to maybe have the option of converting back to the origional engine, I'd like to keep the Citroen gearbox.

Now what I'm looking for is advice as to what engine would be a suitable swap.

The standard NA engine pushes out 160 bph, and 160 ftp torque. As far as I can make out, a turbo version of the same engine would push out approx. 210-220 bhp and 220 ftp torque.

So what I'm looking for i something in the same region as this to keep my gearbox from disintegrating. Preferably an engine without turbo, but with fuel injection.

One option could be a Ford Duratec V6, with a 2.6 litre og 3 litre displacement. There might also be Audi engines that are suitable.

Does anyone have any other good ideas or reccomendations?

Bjorn

[hilly]

I am going to keep quiet on this for the time being as I have already caused too many S3s to get the wrong engine in already.

I don't want to get a reputation for encouraging people to mess about with their cars

Hilly

[matk]

If that's you keeping quiet, I'd hate to hear you shouting!

[hilly]

[jimmybondi]

What I did was dropping in a S4s engine (sans connecting the chargecooler)

Dunno if Garry Kemp is still selling those...

Edited November 7, 2008 by jimmybondi

[andydclements]

And then probably kiss goodbye to the gearbox as it is likely to struggle to cope with 50BHP more than the TE put through it.

[Günter]

As long as you not want to register the car in Germany (mention European regularity's about anything for sound, exhaust systems, pollution class and so on...): 1.8 L / 2.0 L Ford (naturally aspirated), 1.8L VW/Audi (turbo) or anything else with 4cylinder inline conception sounds possible ... .

Edited November 7, 2008 by G

[Wilf]

A 2 litre ford zetec in relatively mild tune could match the 160 bhp the lotus engine gave, with the added benefit that scrappers are full of them!

[bpaar]

Take a look at the Honda K series 4 cyl. Basically the same weight as a lotus lump, chain drive cam, very compact alum block, internal oil cooler etc.

Some choices (stock hp) ...

K20A2 - ~220hp, 170 torque (acura rsx type s) 2.0L

K20A3 - ~160hp, 140 torque (base acura rsx) 2.0L

K24A2 - ~200hp, 180 torque (acura tsx) 2.4L

K24A3 - ~165hp, 160 torque (honda accord,element) 2.4L

K24A4 - ~165hp, 160 torque (honda crx) 2.4L

a close relative (and my personal choice)

F20C - ~240hp 160 torque 9,200 redline (honda S2000, since 2005 this is a 2.2L with more torque)

many hot rod parts available to boost stock output.

Bill

[plumdeplakmuis]

Get a S4 engine with fuel injection,

That would do the trick.

Or I think the best option.

Keep your current engine, install lumenition throttlebody's and injectionsystem. (and maybe some balacing)

This would be the easiest way, improve reliability (al lot more than an alien engine) and keeps the value of your car the highest.

[SubWoofer]

Motor-teknikk in Oslo will balance your crank and flywheel for 1400NOK + MVA.

[lotusross]

One thing you don't want to overlook - make sure the engine turns the same direction, I think some of the Honda engines turn clockwise - you don't want to have 5 reverse gears.

If I were to do my engine swap over again, I would use a Mercedes engine - so - that's my 2 cents.

[Günter]

special point on that: even not every 'Mercedes' engine is an Mercedes engine -so why not !

Who cares about original conceptions, especially as the Image of Lotus cars is still in that 'Kit-Car' area...

[Tony K]

There is nothing so "unreliable" about the 9XX series engine -- or the way they are dressed in the Esprit -- that it requires more maintenance, work, or cost than doing an engine swap. Regular, skilled inspection and service, and attending to things that decay beyond just timing belts -- such as wiring, ancillaries, etc. -- costs less up front and less overall than doing an engine swap, and is a whole lot less work.

I am a purist, but I don't get my panties in a bunch when someone does an engine swap or other modifications. I am also skilled in several areas of auto repair and restoration and have a specialist's shop at my disposal, and have always found it to make more sense (both financially and in labor hours) up front, over the long haul, and at the time of sale to keep the original engine and maintain the car properly rather than do a swap. Keeping a car in fussy good mechanical order is easier and more reliable than spending months (or even years) sorting out the bugs of re-engineering it.

This is coming from someone who drives an average of 7k miles per year on 30-year-old exotic cars and will take an S1 750 miles away from home on a deserted highway twisting and turning through the woods, hours away from help.

Hilly is the exception, not the rule, when it comes to engine swaps. Most engine swap Esprits I have ever seen are stalemated projects collecting dust in someone's garage, or don't run, or are reduced to being "toys" can't be driven long distances. The ones that do run are either hacked up with pipes and vents sticking out of them all over the place, and/or have melted areas of the body, and/or other compromises. Show me an Esprit with a non-Lotus engine that has done more than 10k miles -- there are very few. For most Esprits, an engine swap project is the equivalent of hospice.

Edited November 10, 2008 by Tony K

[Jeanvm]

Indeed an engine swap is costly and time consuming. You have to change hundred of other things to make the car driving.

And also the car will have much less value.

[lotusross]

Tony does have a very good point - the reason I did my swap is because I wanted something special, something I could call my own - but it has been a year and a half since the car has moved under it's own power.

I am very close (I almost had it running this year, but I need a few more parts)

If you want to drive it - Tony is correct - the only thing I would do is to update to a pertronix ignition kit and add an MSD 6AL box.

Keep the carbs in tune and run synthetic oil.

That being said - if it were me and I was doing it all over again.

I would run a Mercedes engine.

[trackmagic]

You might want to explore here a bit.

Jeff

http://www.jhps.com/

[yeti]

Some good stuff there

I see several of you recommend changing to injection. Why exactly will that give me a more reliable engine? I assume I would need an engine management system as well?

Bjorn

[lotusross]

When my Esprit was in stock form - the only real problems I had with the engine were electrical problems.

An engine only needs air, fuel, spark to run - I have had Delloroto's and Webers - I prefered the Deloroto's - but no matter what you use - they need to be kept in tune.

Fuel injection is OK but it would be a job to put it on the Lotus engine (not a big one, but a job just the same).

If you want to just drive it - I would make sure the carbs are in tune and that you have reliable spark.

My Lotus only let me down a few times - once the starter exploded internally (push start got me going, so not a big deal) and the other time was a bad Accel coil - believe it or not.

The ignition is something I would get to right away though, stock it uses a points system, and that's about as reliable as Lindsay Lohan.

Or - you could use a Mercedes Engine. If I ever sell my BMW powered Lotus - my next swap will involve a Mercedes engine.

Edited November 11, 2008 by lotusross

[Tony K]

Some good stuff there

I see several of you recommend changing to injection. Why exactly will that give me a more reliable engine? I assume I would need an engine management system as well?

Bjorn

Aside from the expected improvements in fuel atomization/mileage/power, I would think a properly done injection setup would pose less of a risk for fire. Many Esprits have perished from leaky carb bodies, banjo fittings, fuel lines, O-rings, etc. Again, that kind of prevention comes down to skilled preventative maintenance, but injection should require less maintenance in every regard.

[yeti]

If I was to change the points to something more reliable, where would I go?

Bjorn

[trackmagic]

The Lotus high energy electronic setup would be my first try.

Jeff

[yeti]

Is that standard for the newer 912 and 910 engines?

Bjorn

[Tony K]

I use the Lumenition kit with the optical sensor (not the Hall-effect type). I think it is essentially the same as what the S3 Esprits used. I have not had any issues in 10 years with Lumenition.

[Jeanvm]

Must say, the Lumenition works fine but the Pertronix is the much better one, in damp and winter condition its start better.

That