free hit
counters
Both Wastegates Seized - Induction/Turbo/Manifold/Exhaust - The Lotus Forums Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
buckster

Both Wastegates Seized

Recommended Posts

Hello!

I was up at SLS this morning getting my new decats put on and got the bad news that both wastegates are seized, no chance of freeing them up.

Please can someone provide advice, let me know who does the best prices out there even if on an exchange basis?

Thanks, always appreciate the guidance.

Buck

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Upgrade today to remove Google ads and support TLF.

Hi Peter...

We tried the WD40 route etc, no luck.... I had seen your previous post on the forum from which you managed to get yours sorted.

To be honest, car has done 55k miles, still on orig turbos etc, Ali from SLS was suggesting to get both replaced, perhaps a good investment now?

Also, leading up to the car being booked in, a metal rattle noise was coming from the nearside back of the car. Ali was 99% sure this is from the wastegate being knackered, also read a similar post on the forum - not looking good :sofa:

SLS are phoning around at the moment, need to try and keep the costs down as my warranty only covers for so much.

I assume these units are your standard garret T25 turbos??? Lotus were wanting

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's the housing that's different and supply and demand. Esprit V8's didn't have the huge numbers like GM etc so hence the price. If your guy is insisting on new turbos and you have the money then buy them.

Personally I think the old ones can be freed. I know PNM Engineering have freed mine up on my previous Esprit loads of times. You can either send your turbos to them or drive down to them and they do insitu.

Alternatively, get the reconditioned for about

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You should ring around a few dealers, see who will do you the best price. The turbo and actuator are all in stock at Lotus.

Here is some info from an expert within!

Reading the posting it sounds like the wastegates in the Turbo Body are stuck.

If they are stuck they are usually in the closed position but could be partially open if the actuators are defective (broken / corroded spring) .

They can normally be freed by careful manipulation and WD 40.

If they are stuck closed the car will have been overboosting.

The usual problem is failed Actuators (capsule) which is a simple job of replacing them and setting up the preload (instructions setting pressure are in the workshop manual) after fitting the new parts.

He needs to check if the actuators are working as well as checking the wastegate flap valve movement.

The Wastegate Flap only usually seizes if the actuators have been inoperable for some time or the car not used for long periods.

It is not very clear from the thread what has actually happened.

If there is a rattle from the engine area it could be a partially open wastegate flap or possibly a broken manifold heatshield.

They should check the heatshields - easy to check as you can get to them with your hand and see of they are loose or broken. Revving the engine while the car is on a hoist will determine where the rattle is coming from - Heatshield or Turbo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Also, leading up to the car being booked in, a metal rattle noise was coming from the nearside back of the car. Ali was 99% sure this is from the wastegate being knackered, also read a similar post on the forum - not looking good :)

Buck,

Sorry to hear about your car.

Regarding the metallic noise, did it happen above 3,500rpm and sound like a couple of nuts rattling in a tin can. I have that noise but only under moderate to hard acceleration?

Murray Motors couldn't find the problem and neither did Falkland Performance Centre.

If it is the same noise how can I check the wategates on my car and what am I looking for?

Regards,

Brian

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi...

Thanks for all the feedback!

I am still ringing about although SJS told me they can do an exchange/recondition for

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One other possible source of a rattle at 3,500rpm is the O2 sensors. I have one that is often coming loose. It rattles a little and then a bit more and then it settles at that level since the cables prevent it from undoing any further. I suspect I need to change the sealing washer that will probably help to lock it in place. FYI the one that sometimes rattles on mine is the drivers site pre CAT I think from memory.

I have recently changed the CATs which is also likely to be partly responsible due to the undoing and re-doing up of the sensors without new washers.

I had refurbished turbos from TurboTechnics. They upgraded the bearings while refurbishing the units. Originally they quoted about

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Morning!

I spoke with Turbo Centre UK this morning who believe it's a simple case of freeing up the wastegates, repair any damage (rattle) and do a full healthcheck on the unit. Should a rebuild be required they will do it but it's highly unliklely, cost could be only

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Mike,

As soon as camera is recharged will take some pics and post them up

Nellie :devil:

Mike,

Pics of the turbine and compressor

post-3421-1239650616_thumb.jpg

post-3421-1239650627_thumb.jpg

Nellie :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

Oh yes, you can easily see that they used the standard turbine and married this with a bigger compressor wheel. And additionally they clipped the turbine wheel. you can see that there is someting removed at the edges.

This is not necessarily a bad thing, its just about what you are wanting to get.

What you have now is a higher flowing system at higher rpms - and a less efficient system at lower rpms !

The clipped turbine produces less backpressure (especially at high rpms) BUT as a downside it will be less responsive at lower rpms. ---> more lag !

If they had not clipped the turbine wheel you would have a significant empasis on the mid range and a loss in low- AND high-rpms.

Cheers

Marcus

Hi Mike,

As soon as camera is recharged will take some pics and post them up

Nellie :wub:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey..

Am still having a nightmare with these wastegates. My mechanic has had the car for almost x1 week, managed to free up the nearside wastegate (now moving great) but has no access to the offside one, said it's going to be impossible to get this one sorted :cheers:

We obviously couldn't get the turbos off to send them away, decided on lots of WD40 and patience.

He did say both were sezied partially open hence why I wasn't getting overboost but there was still plenty of power....

Any suggestions on the nearside wastegate to free up, it's driving me crazy and would like it fixed.

It's been a nightmare doing this work and getting the De-Cats on as all the nuts/bolts were corroded, some needing to be cut out, however, the car sounds incredible with the PNM pipes and Larini centre section, am sure it will be worth it in the end!

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Buckie,

Not knowing one end of a spanner from the other, I am sorry I can't help.

You mentioned that your wastegates were seized partially open and you were not getting overboost but still had plenty power.

Forgive my ignorance but what does overboost feel/sound like or do you have a boost gauge fitted to your car?

I know earlier turbo's had a boost gauge fitted but I don't have one on my V8 and don't know if my turbo's are overboosting or not. I too have plenty of power.

I think I should check my wastegates in any event given the problems you are having with your car.

Brian

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello!

With the wastegates stuck partial open, the response in lower gears would have been less (although felt plenty quick to me) which would have been a bit like more lag I suppose. If the wastegates were stuck in the closed position, I guess this would have caused over-boosting, engine light on and perhaps "safe mode" - someone correc me if wrong?

I have purchased a turbo gauge this morning and will install once I get the car back. A bodyshop is going to fabricate it onto the centre panel (ie above the vents), bit like the Focus ST option. If it doesn't work out I can always replace the panel and move it but hoping it looks ok.

Cheers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I change gear I can hear a slight whooshing sound which I take it is the pressure being released from the turbo's and therefore I have assumed that my wastegates are not seized.

Is my thinking correct?

I will still check my wastegates though.

Brian

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

on an stock-condition car you can hear the spool up/down of the compressor side (fresh-air side) in the inlet pipes . Mostly around 2000-2200 rpm, on gearchanges/ change between WOT/close down (especially with K&N , or similar.). Bud the 'wastegates' are internal parts in the turbo/exhaust system.. . Not easy to hear an difference..

Edited by G

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with Gunter...

If nobody had told me both wastegates were seized, I would never have known and to be honest wished I hadn't now :cheers:

Cheers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Presumably stuck open is better than stuck closed as I would suspect that stuck open wouldn't do the turbo's any good over a period of time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

undo the cat pipes, check that you can move the actuator lever by hand (against spring load), and that the small flap sits fully closed (without shaking around) in the lever return position... . On RH-side there is not much space between engine-block and actuator-clamp on fully open (lever moved fully out) position !

Edited by G

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Having had this problem on my previous Esprit as well as badly corroded turbos I am going for some preventative maintenance on my new one and have just acquired a very nice pair of wastegate capsules from Superdave. They look great and will hopefully last me a few years. The car goes in for a full service next week and they will be fitting them for me.

Buckster - you haven't mentioned the rattle recently. Are you certain its something to do with the wastegate? It could be the dreaded heat shield rattle. I've got that (at just above tickover. Most annoying) and have acquired the Ramspott and Brandt replacements which are twice the thickness of the standard items and higher grade steel. Its an engine out job of course but as I'll be having the cambelt done service done now is the time to do it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

can we come to an agreement that there are a few places for rattles: heatshields on the manifold, heatshields on the 'radius arm'/engine mount points, rattling catalysts and finally those round flaps that normally close the bypass inside the turbo, bud do rattle if the actuator gos not fully on return backways !?

cheers!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  


×