Lotus 'plans to build V8 engine'

[jonwat 362]

Article on TLF Edited December 16, 2010 by Bibs

[Bibs 10,694]

They're planning on an F1 engine too!

[ramjet 1,069]

Where are they getting all the money from?

[Bibs 10,694]

They've got £770m to spend in investment underwritten by the Malaysian Govt.

[rogerch 63]

They had

Obviously I'm privy to numbers, but Paris would have cost a bit.

Shops ?

Metamorphosis

Renault sponsorship

The 125

Oh and a TV that doesn't seem to be going to air.

770 million and counting-------------down.

Are we any closer to a replacement Esprit ?

[Bibs 10,694]

Roger, as explained before, the Esprit is the one car that's flat out under development at present. The article linked about is about development of an in-house engine for it rather than transplanting something out of a Toyota/Lexus again.

Paris cost £3m.

Shop (1) perhaps £250k to lease, fit and stock - It's a retail business, it will turn a profit.

Metamorphosis probably £50-100k.

Renault deal is £60m over 3 years.

T125 makes money, it's a car that they're selling.

TV? No idea what you're on about.

If you were a CEO of a car company, ex-Ferrari and other large corporates, how would you be spending $1bn! Producing £35k sportscars?

Marketing is everything. Perception is everything. You can't throw this much shit without some of it sticking for want of a better phrase!

[simonb 12]

Cant help but think that should Lotus really want to evolve from an engineering company that carries a car maker, to a profit making car manufacturer, then it really should be selling cars. The Elise S is the market they are running away from, and the Evora has not seen any step change (IMHO) under the new regime. If Evoras are being discounted to sell (at least overseas) then how can the replacement sell at a higher price point?

Would not be surprised if sales fall to 100 cars a month in the run up to scheduled Esprit launch if they dont do anything

[Bibs 10,694]

With only the asthmatic Elise 1.6 and Evora/S for sale currently and for the next couple of years unless new engine variants for the Elige are revealed, I don't think Lotus currently care (as much as the dealers anyway!) about current car sales. As noted, they've enough cash to see them through to the 'new era'.

Don't get me wrong, I may often come across as a fanboy (in fairness I've owned Lotus cars for the last decade and then some so I do like them) but I don't just fawn at everything they say. I do admire what they're up to now though, if it does have substance and will bring Lotus up to the fore with the likes of Ferrari. I still think their marketing dept are shockingly dreadful though!

[rogerch 63]

If you were a CEO of a car company, ex-Ferrari and other large corporates, how would you be spending $1bn! Producing £35k sportscars?

I wouldn't be throwing the baby out with the bath water without making sure I had a tap.

[jonwat 362]

Can't see why they can't develop the last V8, it was designed as a modular unit that could be downsized to a V6 & with enough boost it would produce more than enough power for 200MPH+

They're also threatening to move production abroad again according to article in yesterday's FT.

[Bibs 10,694]

As such, I thought I'd use a lovely pic of that engine in our article on the matter.

[ads_green 12]

Hah - I thought Lotus swore to never build their own engine again after the V8.

[neill1607 1]

Can't remember the engine specs that were proposed for the new esprit, but surely a little development work on the existing 918 engine would pay dividends. Cost savings on tooling etc.

All in all it seems to have been a fairly reliable unit (never owned one though) & some people (Mike Sekinger for instance) don't seem to have too much trouble extracting more HP than standard!

I agree that Lotus as a group could do with "bigger & better" things (don't think they should forget their roots either) but it just seems like they're ignoring some of the assets they already have. Now they've got some money (Don't know if that was instigated by Mike Kimberley or Dany Bahar, but to get that amount of money out of anyone in the current climate is no mean feat) they just seem to be gong on a spend, spend, spend spree.

[ads_green 12]

The engine had a few issues initially and in 350bhp trim with two turbos was probably very understressed. the problem was I imagine the huge effort that goes into designing, building, testing and (now importantly) getting it certified for various markets only makes it commercially viable in large numbers. Even current Ferrari engines can trace their lineage back as an evolution of previous designs rather than complete brand new bespoke units. They don't reinvent the wheel for every new car.

That being said, I don't think a premium brand wannabe can use other engines that don't meet the same expectations - using a Toyota/Lexus engine (apart from the lush LF-A v10) would probably detract from the brand. I don't think you have to build them yourselves though as Pagani do well with Merc engines and Mclaren were never hindered by using a BMW unit. I think it's more the case of picking the right engine than obsessing with the manufacturer. If Lexus offered a LF-A derived NA V8 reving to 9k rpm kicking out 450bhp then I can't see too many people being put off by the lexus tagline.

[plumdeplakmuis 34]

Lotus building their own engines for their roadcars.

Best news about Lotus since the launch of the Evora.

[ronin 37]

I put my name down on a new Esprit because of its use of an unstressed Toyota engine...Starting completely from scratch with a new engine design may put my desire on the back burner until it's proven its self in the real world.....

[Tony K 127]

The original Esprit having Lotus' own powerplant has always been a key part of its allure, as well as what made Lotus a credible competitor to the world's other top marques. The more a specialty car company has its own engine, the higher on the totem pole it is. All of this talk of Lotus growing and moving back upmarket continually compares them to Ferrari and Porsche; please note that the boutique manufacturers who source BMW engines and such are never mentioned in the same breath as these legendary companies. Lotus belongs with the legends, not the start-ups and cottages.

Granted, Lotus' claim to dominance has always been in the chassis; if the engine is traditionally what 'makes' a Ferrari, the chassis is what 'makes' a Lotus . . .

I'm not in the market for a new Esprit (yet ), but the one secret wish I have had for the past few years with all the talk of the new Esprit was/is that it have a LOTUS engine.

[ads_green 12]

McLaren are cottage startup?

What about Lamborghini? their engines are based on (and built by) Audi.

I have to say I agree with Frank - I'd have no interest in buying a brand new esprit with an unproven engine.

Was a quirk for a TVR and older Lotus's but for a 140k modern supercar is frankly laughable.

[Stirling_Villeneuve 105]

Does this mean every new Lotus will have a bespoke engine? If not will the others be less desirable? Surely there's a danger this would scupper the Elan, Elite and Eterne before they've even left the drawing board? On the other hand part of the appeal of the Elise/Evora is the reliability and the running cost of the oily bits although I accept to some people those cars will never have the thoroughbred appeal of a Ferrari, Maserati, Lamborghini, Aston.

Ambitious indeed... at this rate it's only a matter of time before they announce a rival to this project....

http://www.virgingalactic.com/overview/

[Bibs 10,694]

Keep up at the back!

[Stirling_Villeneuve 105]

Keep up at the back!

Just announced

Orbital Shuttle, the space Elise

Lunar Lander, 2+2

Mars Probe, 4 door, 4 seater

Starship, the Esprit of the Lotus Galactic Range

All to be built at the new base in Roswell

Edited December 16, 2010 by Stirling_Villeneuve

[Buddsy 1,575]

I do like the idea but in the real world becoming an engine manufacturer would be quite risky IMHO. Getting an engine designed, made tested takes quite some effort. But then there is the spares issue, you breakdown and you need a Toyota part is one think but needing a Lotus part....

I also don’t think having a Lotus tuned Toyota engine would really put potential buyers off so much as a less potentially less reliable Lotus unit.

I suppose the engines could work out cheaper for Lotus and they could be sold to others. But didn’t Lotus just do a big get into bed with Toyota?

I guess it’s a case of weighing benefits to advantages but to me doesn’t look like it would be worth it?

Buddsy

[simonb 12]

Audi / Lamborghini get away with sharing powerplants. I think that tweaked Toyota would be better than "out the box" (and it is no secret that Evora SC is an existing mundane Aussie lump), and maybe latest generation rather than previous generation Toyota would help also.

I think that most car enthusiasts recognise the ability of the Japanses to build well machined engines. I would prefer Lotus to "in house" tweak some of those units rather than either farming it out (PTP stuff for the K series was hardly superb), or having the reliability issues that small run products are bound to be prone to (and also cost issues).

If you want a car that goes like a ferrari, and can put up with one as reliable as a Ferrari, and have the money to buy a Ferrari, I dont think you buy a Lotus. If you can get a car (maybe even Ferrari money) that handles like a Lotus, goes like a Ferrari, but is as reliable as a Lexus, then you have a place in the market

[comem47 200]

Group Lotus just announced a new joint venture with Richard Branson. The Virgin Galactic Space Plane is now renamed the "Lotus Pan Galactic Gargle Blaster" (no licensing fees paid to Douglas Adams of course!)

Pictured below is 2-tongued Zaphod Bahar at the press conference and the new liveried plane. Mr Bahar declined the use of an interpreter for the simulcast broadcast to the UK and Malaysia, preferring to talk in both languages at once to the remote audiences. Tony Fernandes later revealed the content was entirely different. Hey!!!

Edited December 16, 2010 by comem47

[Advantage 910]

Lotus are very good at designing engines, they've done it in the past for other manufacturers with good results.