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Sueing an American


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We had a guy in Colorado Springs buy an Exige car cover & some other stuff but despite FedEx getting him to sign for it he's done a chargeback and is denying it arrived. His bank don't seem to care much but I'm out of pocket £396.70 since May 10. What's the procedure for issuing proceedings? I'd fly over and bop him on the nose but I'd probably get shot or something!

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

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Thats a right......pain! Bibs could you claim off FedEx? The whole business of signing for stuff is a load of bollocks anyway. I had a blackberry phone turn up in the post one day at work. It wasnt addressed to me and I didnt know the name of the cahp whos it was. After a couple of days a guy came round the door asking if we had seen a phone! Turns out the delivery driver has signed for it himself "fred" and put it through our door. Poor lad had phoned vodaphone who couldnt care less as it was signed for and he was still being charged for it!!! Lucky for him I hadnet sold it on ebay!

Buddsy

 

"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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At this point in time I would forget about the individual and consentrate on FedEx. Not defending the individual but he may actually not have it even though FedEx have a signiture.

First Question - is it his signiture when signed for or did somebody else take delivery. Not sure where the buck stops with Delivery Companies though. Ie don't know if the price you paid to get it delivered covers the cost of Insurance (usially does if Gtd delivery) to FedEx if item goes astray.

If it turns out to be his signiture or somebody at that address, then that's step 2. Have we any Forum members nearby you could PM to see if they are will to maybe do a drive by with camera (if lucky enough to find an Exige with a cover over it parked outside)

Stating the obvious here really but it's 'evidence and proof' you are looking for at this stage.

3. If guilty, the name and shame over as many Lotus related forums as possible.

Edited by mayesprit

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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What an ar$ewipe. :2guns:

Can you find out if he is a member of a club over there and notify the club president? Also tell them that if anyone else from the club wants anything that it isn't going to happen due to the actions of one of their members.

Other than that, I'm sure your UK legal service will be able to point you in the right direction or one of the US guys on here will know how to kick it off. And make sure they notify him that there'll be interest charges on it.

Do you get a copy or can you get the original of the signed delivery docket from Fed-Ex?

All we know is that when they stop making this, we will be properly, properly sad.Jeremy Clarkson on the Esprit.

Opinions are like armpits. Everyone has them, some just stink more than others.

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We spend thousands with Fedex and have a copy of his legible signature with time/date of delivery on the delivery slip. He clearly received it but has been hard work throughout.

I've taken to trying to call him every morning when I sit at my desk at 9am, not sure what the time is in Colorado but he doesn't answer, it just rings through to voicemail eventually.

I'll happily start proceedings, it's easy in the UK, I just need to know the USA procedure.

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators. I will aim to respond to emails/PM's Mon-Fri 9-6 GMT. 

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9am is 2am in Colorado. Ideal time to call him if you want to annoy him which could be a good tactic.

9pm might be a better time if you want to speak to him?

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About 6 hours behind so that's around 3am his time. Try around 5pm our time might get a pick up.

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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Check your T & C's.

You should/may have limited jurisdiction to the courts of England & Wales.

If so, issue here. You must then serve outside the jurisdiction but different time limits apply for him to respond ( not the usual 14 days )

If your T & C's don't limit jurisdiction to England & Wales, you issue in his jurisdiction or where the contract was concluded. If he paid before you delivered the goods, I would argue the contract was concluded here.

Hope this helps.

Wing Commander Dibble DFC<br /><br />
North Midlands Esprit Group<br /><br />
NMEG "the formidable squadron"<br /><br />
"probably the most active Esprit group in the world" Andy Betts, Castle Combe May 2007

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:veryangry::veryangry:

Create a Facebook profile with a picture of a pretty lady (or you in a dress), add him as a friend, gain his trust...then say your granny is ill and to send loads of cash for her medicine ASAP!!

Seriously though I'm disappointed that a Lotus owner can be that :censored: dishonest!

Marge: Homer, I don't want you driving around in a car you built yourself.

Homer : Marge, you can either sit there complaining, or you can knit me some seat belts...

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TBH for £400 in UK with receipt denied, i would not pursue without evidence that the signature looks like his signature.

I would contact his local dealer & local club to see if he is a member - US forums might get a drive by of the address (maybe with only a camera if you are unlucky)

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I've seen his house on streeview, not sure that knowing where he lives would help and he said it was a gift for his father so I doubt it will be at his house, even if I could convince one of our american friends to go and pinch it back for me!

I think I'll speak with Fedex first and claim on the insurance and perhaps they'll send a couple of vans around. His bank aren't responding to Streamline's huge wad of evidence that he's a lying twat.

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators. I will aim to respond to emails/PM's Mon-Fri 9-6 GMT. 

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Erm, you know his name/number? I think America is a fairly big place! :lol::P

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators. I will aim to respond to emails/PM's Mon-Fri 9-6 GMT. 

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This is the downside to runing a Business. There will always be the odd James Blunt who will try to get one over on you. I'm sure in the end you will recoup your monies via FedEx & Insurance but it is the general hassle and time spent that is the worst part to this sort of exexcise. It will usially unfortunately turn out to still cost, maybe even more than the item by the time you work out your hourly rate to get the monies back.

Still worth it though. Just me and not good for Business, but would rather be out of pocket and rightly win as opposed to be shafted.

Good luck

Edited by mayesprit

Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk - that will teach us to keep mouth shut!

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In truth I guess we've been lucky. This is the first problem in nearly 900 customers, everyone else has been just lovely :D

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators. I will aim to respond to emails/PM's Mon-Fri 9-6 GMT. 

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Did his credit card company not contact you before the charge back? normally they do to verify the claim/accusation is a legitimate one. If you have a copy of his signature from Fedex and it is indeed his signature then FedEx has fulfilled their service and there is no claim against them. I would be going after his credit card company for the funds. Use the proof of delivery to support your case. I have had over charges applied to my account before and have had to a 3-way conference call between me, the credit card company and the vendor to get the over charges refunded.

Edited by GavinT
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I understand the frustration, Bibs, but there's no way on Earth you could accomplish this for less than a few thousand dollars. At the very lest you'd have to show up in "small claims court" but I don't know how that wouldwork for a foreign citizen.

I think you're really getting screwed by the credit card company. This guy may be an asshole, but your card company needs to have you back.

Also, I know you say the package was signed for, but I've had many, many, FedEx packages say they were signed for when I was no where near home. I know you say you see a legit signature, but how can you know? What do you have to compare it to?

Luke Colorado, Super Spy.   -  Lotus Owner No Longer

1987 Zender Widebody 560SEC | 1994 Lotus Esprit S4 | 2013 Honda Fit EV (#269)

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I'm no expert, but from my experience, I'd agree with Gavin and Lucas.

One thing I'm disappointed with about our system in the States is that it is so difficult/expensive to go after money you are owed that it makes going after smaller sums not worth it. The people this reality hurts the most are those for whom that few/several hundred dollars is most vital: For someone for whom several hundred dollars is all the money in the world and can have a significant impact on their life, they, practically speaking, have no recourse.

My suggestion: If, and only if, it is NOT violating any agreement/terms/privacy laws or rules, etc., I wold out him publicly. Scam alert. At the very least, privately let other Lotus merchandise and parts vendors know about him.

Tony K. :)

 

Esprit S1s #355H & 454H

Esprit S2.2  #324J

1991 Esprit SE

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Bib's be happy to drive down and check for you! Shoot me his address.

Heaven is where the police are British, the chefs Italian, the mechanics German, the lovers French and it is all organized by the Swiss. Hell is where the police are German, the chefs British, the mechanics French, the lovers Swiss and it is all organized by the Italians.

You make something idiotproof, they'll make a better idiot

You think professional is expensive, just wait until you pay for amateur.

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Tony:

I've seen plenty of instances where "naming and shaming" on a forum gets you sued. I wouldn't recommend that. Bibs might find himself in hot water!

Perhaps, though, if it was done in a vague way in the "Rocky Mountain" subsections of all the Elise forums you could get away with it. ;)

Seriously....this needs to be pursued (no pun intended) through the credit card processor.

Luke Colorado, Super Spy.   -  Lotus Owner No Longer

1987 Zender Widebody 560SEC | 1994 Lotus Esprit S4 | 2013 Honda Fit EV (#269)

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That sucks Bibs, sorry to hear. Perhaps there might be a lawyer over on Lotus Talk who would be willing to help you with the legal issues? I've had to use Small Claims court to recover money and it is a real pain in the arse plus they have a time frame for claims.

Good luck

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I've seen plenty of instances where "naming and shaming" on a forum gets you sued. I wouldn't recommend that.

Ditto. Don't do it. Work back channels like the one I emailed you, or take Bob up on his offer to suss out the guy's rep.

1983 "Investor's Special Edition" Turbo Esprit (#43/50) | 2012 Evora S

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