S4s headlamps won't pop

[luggal]

I've just run into a problem with the headlamp pods on my '95 S4s. When I press the switch, both lamps illuminate, but both of the pods stay down. I thought it might be a fuse. After a bit of searching here I saw that it could be fuses A10 and A11. I checked both and they look good. Someone also mentioned, though unlikely, to check a few of the relays for the dip beam, main beam and pod delay. They all appear ok.

Following another suggestion, I also lightly tapped on both pod motors with the blunt end of a screwdriver... nada.

I noticed after the last few washes that a lot of water collects in the pod recesses. Maybe they've rusted up? It's just odd that they would both stop working at the same time.

Any thoughts?

[CNH]

I've just run into a problem with the headlamp pods on my '95 S4s. When I press the switch, both lamps illuminate, but both of the pods stay down. I thought it might be a fuse. After a bit of searching here I saw that it could be fuses A10 and A11. I checked both and they look good. Someone also mentioned, though unlikely, to check a few of the relays for the dip beam, main beam and pod delay. They all appear ok.

Following another suggestion, I also lightly tapped on both pod motors with the blunt end of a screwdriver... nada.

I noticed after the last few washes that a lot of water collects in the pod recesses. Maybe they've rusted up? It's just odd that they would both stop working at the same time.

Any thoughts?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Water in the pods means you have the drain holes plugged up with debris.

You can manually raise the lights with the manual knobs on the back of each light pod under the fron bonnet.

I think some times the switches go bad. Use a multi meter and probe the switch as you move through the different position and also the relay jacks. You can also use the multimeter to see if the lift motors are getting the proper voltage. If not back trace it and see where the power is interupted.

Calvin

[x6gas]

The rubber bump stops that the push rods hit can deteriorate and cause the push rods to "lock out". Unlikely that both would happen at once though...

Ian

[superdavelotus]

Have you tried the headlamp motor relay? This is different to the headlight relays.

[luggal]

Thanks for the quick replies

I can manually raise and lower the pods and after disconnecting the pusharms I was able to clear out the ecosystem that was blocking up the drain holes. Living in the sticks, I need to keep an eye on that more often.

Starting with the headlamp motor relay: can someone point out its exact location? I'm working off of the ebay'ed service notes PDF and I don't see anything like it. I only see the A10 and A11 fuses related to the lift motors and the beam relays mentioned previously. I'm in the US (LHD).

Next, if I were to disconnect the lead(s) to the headlamp motor(s) and hook them up to my multimeter, what should I see when I press the headlight switch:

About what should the voltage be?

Will it be steady power when I press the headlight switch, or a short on-then-off?

Thanks!

[superdavelotus]

Hi there. On a RHD car it's the second relay in from bulkhead on left hand side. It's relay 29 on your handbook. If you have broadband I can email the parts/service manual to you. It's 63MB. Or i can save certain sections and email just the electrical section if you wish?

[luggal]

Hi there. On a RHD car it's the second relay in from bulkhead on left hand side. It's relay 29 on your handbook. If you have broadband I can email the parts/service manual to you. It's 63MB. Or i can save certain sections and email just the electrical section if you wish?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Unfortunately, I don't have the handbook. Does this look like it (RHD vs. LHD):

This is from the PDF I referenced above. I wonder if it's the same thing - it's 63MB and named "93 manual.pdf". Ebay special heh.

If not, I'm on broadband. My email is luggal AT gmail DOT com

Many thanks for helping me out! The only Lotus dealer here in Connecticut doesn't like to work on cars that weren't purchased from them. They will do the basics for me (oil changes, coolant flushes), but they turned down a break job, windshield replacement and a few other things

[gb_brown]

Sorry cannot remember which one is the headlamp motor relay off the top of my head, but when I first got my SE I had the same problem. Taking the relay out and making sure it was seated properly cured the problem, since then (over a year ago) I've not had this happen again.

[1esprit]

It might be a problem with the main headlamp switch. I had a similar problem a few months ago with my V8 and it turned out to be the switch. Also, have you tried pulling back on your turn signal lever to engage the "flash to pass"? I'm curious if that will raise the pods in your case. Good luck.

[CNH]

Next, if I were to disconnect the lead(s) to the headlamp motor(s) and hook them up to my multimeter, what should I see when I press the headlight switch:

About what should the voltage be?

Will it be steady power when I press the headlight switch, or a short on-then-off?

Thanks!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Somewhere around 14v if the battery is good shape.

Not sure but it should be constant voltage with the limiter switch of the motor cutting power when the pod has reached proper position is a common design.

To determine relay problems you can also remove the relay and probe the VDC supply and closure from the switch.

With the battery disconnected you can also use a toner hooked up the binnacle switch and use either a contact or induction probe to trace the wire and voltage path.

I would say it is either the switch or the relay.

There are multiple blades on the switch and 2 of them are used to raise and lower the pod others are for the lights themselves. I have seen just a pair of switch contacts go out and the rest were fine. If it is the switch you can use contact cleaner but be careful of the overspray as the cleaner will remove paint and the switch icons.

Out of the relays I have seen a few problems for the headlamps,one is the pod relay and the other is the start up relay. Yours is not the start up relay as you would be having all sorts of other problems like the blower motor, stereo, etc. upon ignition switch activation.

A lot of the relays are the same, mark the top of the pod relay with a marker then swap it out with another. You can change out the relay with a common brand that one finds at the auto store. I think we used onesfrom Bosch as one of the club guys has a whole bag full of them, they only cost $5.

Good Luck,

Calvin

[luggal]

Flipping my highs on, or pulling the lever gives me the brights, but no pod movement.

Somewhere around 14v if the battery is good shape.

Not sure but it should be constant voltage with the limiter switch of the motor cutting power when the pod has reached proper position is a common design.

To determine relay problems you can also remove the relay and probe the VDC supply and closure from the switch.

I've connected my multimeter to the leads that connect to the lift motors. When I press the headlight switch I get a quick reading of around 13, then it's immediately back to 0. When I press the switch off, I get another quick burst of around 13, then back to 0. Strangely, sometimes I see burst readings of 4 and 6... the left and right side perform in the same fasion.

Relay 21 is for the dipped beam and 22 is for the main beam. I've tested both to ensure my normal and high beams fail to operate with the corresponding relays removed. Looks ok.

Relay 29 is for the headlamp pod delay module. I've connected my multimeter and get a reading of around 14 from the socket. The 29 relay "clicks" when I insert it back into the socket.

With the battery disconnected you can also use a toner hooked up the binnacle switch and use either a contact or induction probe to trace the wire and voltage path.

I'm afraid this is beyond my ability and I don't have the proper tools. I can't get the switch out and I'm afraid to force it, even if I wanted to test out another switch.

I would say it is either the switch or the relay.

Switch, relay... or do you think it could be the headlamp pod lift module:

Is it possible this is fried? I get a reading from the 5-pin (female) connector of around 14 with the multimeter and nothing from the 4-pin (female) connector. It looks like a pass-through, since when it is disconnected I get 0 reads from the pod motor connectors when pressing the light switch.

I can't get a clear shot at the 4 male pins to see if I'm getting juice with the 5-pin lead connected. I think it's time to make some calls. Hopefully I can get the Lotus tech at the dealership to have a look. I'll report back with how it turns out.

I appreciate everyones input and I even learned a bit

[1esprit]

I'm still betting that it's the switch. Good luck. I hope you get it sorted out soon.

[ragingfool35]

i recently had same problem and it was the switch.

if the flash function works (pull back on blinker stalk)

then it is the switch.

if you need to replace the control module, i have the cross

ref for the gM part, about $30 if i recall

later

[CNH]

Could be the module or relay as if it were the switch the passing beams should raise the pods via the stalk.

Have you tried to change the relay out with one of the same part number and type in the relay pack? If not change the relay out with one nearby of the same type sd upi could have a relay with bad ntermittant contact.

The gain access to the switch connections you have to remove a single 10mm bolt from the footwell and 2 phillips screws to remove the top binnacle cover.

http://turboesprit.tripod.com/binnacle.html

Once you have the cover off the switches are in upper left in this picture as viewed through the windscreen.

http://turboesprit.tripod.com/binnacle/T0000994.jpg

Are you a member of Lotus LTD? I'm not sure but they might have model specific mentors listed in the directory in your area that may be available to help. I am sorry that I could not visit in person to help as my travel limit to lend assistance at the max is 3-4 hours of the metro area of Minneapolis/St Paul, MN.

[luggal]

Following the instructions I was able to remove the binnacle cover enough to gain access to the switches. I swapped the connections between the parking lights and the headlights as the wired pins looked identical. Assuming this is a valid test, both worked as expected with exception to the pod lift.

When I disconnect the battery and reconnect it, the pods would normally raise for a second and then lower. This no longer occurs either. Maybe an additional hint. This week I'll pick up additional relays to try out.

I'm not a member of Lotus LTD, but I'll check out the site and consider joining. Sad that I've been a Lotus owner ('79 S2 & 95 S4s) for over 10 years now and have not once attended a meet or anything. Sounds like it would be beneficial and fun to get involved with.

if you need to replace the control module, i have the cross

ref for the gM part, about $30 if i recall

If you can supply me with that replacement part # I'd appreciate it.

Once again, I really appreciate the input

[Vulcan Grey]

Another problem with the pods not raising are that the plastic gears break down. Same symptom (lights turn on, but pods don't raise). My friend recently had this problem.

You can take them apart and see. the rebuild kit is cheap.

http://turboesprit.tripod.com/headlight/index.html

http://www.top-downsolutions.com/product_i...&products_id=35

They are basically little plastic cylinders that transfer the motion inside the headlight gear, they break down to tiny little plastic bits.

[ragingfool35]

If you can supply me with that replacement part # I'd appreciate it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

RockAuto.com had them new a few months ago, but I dont see them

listed anymore

used ones at http://www.top-downsolutions.com/product_i...af342439b1ec48f

[esprithk]

hmmm. mine won't go down ....

so I will check the same thing in my Esprit.

anyway, my menu says fuse 25 & fuse 26for headlamp lift motors (15A)

K is Pod delay module <=== this is the relay I must check???

G is Dim dip lift relay (if fitted) <===and I have to check this one, too???

please help, thank you!

[esprithk]

ok...I did the checking

"K" pod delay module, took it out and clean it, and put it back...and one of the headlamps is fixed!

now, it is flipping up and down correctly.

the right headlamp still does not do anything (stay pop-up)

so, time to check the "G" relay and the refuse #25/ #26

ok, "G" relay is taken out, clean up and put it back, no change

and when I try to get the #25/ #26 fuse...I forgot to bring the right tool, I have no way to pull it out by

hand, I tried to use car key to pull it out but without luck.

and then I have a family emergency...so I have to leave my car alone for now.

I will get back to it tomorrow afternoon.

Edited June 21, 2008 by esprithk

[esprithk]

oh..still no luck after changing the fuse.

I will take to a shop nearby to check the switch on the dashboard and the right headlamp motor.

If the switch is ok, I think I will order a new relay.

I think the chance of a bad motor is very small.