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More power and best ways to get it from an Evora NA?


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In response to the rubbish posted by Jim about 'not taking care of customers'.

 

I think anyone in the right state of mind will take of their customers if they would like their business to continue.

In my humble opinion, if there's any issue, the issue should be resolved by the supplier working together with the customer to resolve the matter. I don't think there's any point in starting a public debate as this is down to hardware which needs to be resolved. Old fashioned hand work, research, figuring out why something happens.

 

Jim, if you were the only person in the world who'd be able to produce proper exhausts for Lotus cars you could start asking yourself why hasn't every other supplier abandoned this market?

 

Why would people like ourselves still prefer to work with other suppliers? We're not blind and we don't depend on one supplier for our business.

If a supplier would only cause trouble, this would work it's way through to the market, we would loose market share which would hurt us. Not good and not a sensible move, but yet we do continue rather than getting on our knees begging you to deliver your products.

 

It is interesting to see how you come up with so many 'facts' about other suppliers (not just Larini but everyone you're being compared to). Anybody who works with- or for such other supplier and dares to even raise a question about your products will be attacked and threatened personally.

 

You might want to play the ball, not the man. If you're so convinced of yourself, why not let your products speak or answer a genuine question. Yet you refuse to do that and continue to attack me, drawing away attention from the actual question.

 

To put some balance in this story.. one of the things Larini was acused of was to 'wrap the engine in hot exhaust pipes'.

Below picture is such a wrapped engine. I may well be stupid, but exactly where is that issue you're writing about?

Isn't it true that ANY manifold, short or long will dramatically reduce the engine bay temperature because two pre-cats disappear from the engine bay?

 

EvoraV6manifold.JPG

Edited by YvoTuk
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1/.  You're just another re-seller - you have no involvement in the manufacture or design of Larini exhausts.

 

2/. You're dronnnning on again - but I have seen no dyno graph of your Larini manifolds. You only promised to bring that to the forum when I presented mine - still waiting ............................... and waiting.

 

3/. You said were looking again at the system to make more noise - with a little knowing wink - as if you knew anything about exhaust design - you're just another re-seller.

 

4/. You need to deal with Jez at Back on Track and Phil at Bell & Colvill - two very unhappy people with your Larini exhausts.

 

5/. Looking at the Seloc post about your dronnnnnning Larini exhausts - there's several posters on there you need to deal with too.

 

6/. What is your solution to this dronnnnning problem? And I don't mean looking at the rubber mounts?!

 

7/. Your small-bore Larini system doesn't cut it on the supercharged motor - when will Larini bring out their 70-mm bore system.

 

8/. Will Larini offer a better tailpipe option than the small old-style 2ZZ oval tip?

 

9/. Even your V6 systems dronnnnne  - what's your solution for that?

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If I'm just another reseller, why would you bother to reply? Why would you even bother to think about what I post?

 

I did indeed say I would post up a dyno graph and I'm still planning to, what's the issue? My issue is time.

 

I'm getting lost now.. so wink means I claim to be the god of exhaust tech. Hmm... need to change that in my little book of Internet terminology.

Yes, Larini are working on different systems. Is that surprising?

 

I'm not going into details about any customers. I've always learnt not to hang out dirty laundry. I don't think it's chic to do such thing and I think if you dig around we'll find customers who say the same about you. ..and anyone else for what it matters.

As Bibs wrote, there's two sides to a story.

 

I have indeed noticed there's more people who were mentioning this. Which made me wonder.. why have these people not reported these issues? If it's something you can't live with, why do you keep up with it?

 

There is no set solution for any droning issue. Looking at experiences I've had on my own car, droning CAN be caused by the exhaust, but it can also be caused by something else. On an Elise, the undertray, a rear grille, the floorpan... anything can cause noise / vibrations to be amplified.

Certainly where a lot of people modify cars both mechanically as engine wise resonating frequencies change, so any system can potentially cause droning.

 

No idea on the plans of a 70mm system, maybe ask them?

 

Define a better tip?

 

Well. funny enough I've got one on my car and it doesn't drone. Oh dear..

 

Now.. that's your questions answered... why have you still not answered the question I've raised?

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  • Gold FFM

:gathering:  :censored:  :2guns:  :secret::realmad:  :vava:   :realmad::scared::rant:  :vava:  :sofa:  :shock:  :baby:  :baby:  :wallbash:  :busted cop:   :offtopic:   :getmecoat:

 

You guys need to take this offline and private, not good business at all.

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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He He - I love  good knock-down drag 'em out ding-dong!!

 

Anyone recall the Seloc days of King K and Scuffers et al - superb stuff - informative too :gathering:

 

Let's roll back a few pages to when Yvo-tk started all this by dissing my 3-1 V6 manifold design and calling my dyno graphs fake.

 

Now, I have a few cars, an interest in even more and I'm on a few forums - great for info etc.

 

I have never seen a forum sponsor take a pop at the competition - it just doesn't happen. It's desperation. Well. ok it does happen on the US site LT but the sponsor in question is a fantasist and no-one listens any more.

 

Soooooooo, you have to blame Andy (Bibs) - if he wants a nice quiet forum, with no (highly entertaining) spats between his sponsors he needs to police things better - and not just delete my contentious posts. This forum doesn't belong to Yvo-tk - much as he would like it to be. 

 

 

Aaaaand another thing - I have NEVER threatened anyone personally Mr Tk. I do hope you phoned the police immediately - can't think you would miss an opportunity like that - I would have.

 

Ok, it's Saturday night - need to go spill someone's pint :rambo:

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Fight!

 

Is this the point where Harry Hill enters stage right? :scooter:

 

On a sensible note though, and bringing the thread back on track about increasing power of the NA Evora, it was interesting to note the mention about the engine bay heat. It got me wondering about the manifold configs (the two options on the market I’ve seen are 3-1 or 3-2-1). Which is better or is there not a lot in it in the real world? I guess gas flow efficiency is key (lots of variables to play with like pipe length and diameter etc.).

 

To me my engineering gut feeling (and I'm no expert) says 3-1 if I ever had to change the exhaust manifolds and downpipes – it’s simpler compared to 3-2-1, which kind of follows the Chapman ethos. Also, in aviation there's the saying "if it looks right it is right" (the Hawker Hunter is a prime example) and to me a 3-1 looks right.

 

Could be talking a load of hog wash, but maybe a worthwhile discussion point? :geek:

Edited by EuropaSman

Lover of everything Lotus Cars and proud owner of production Evora No.75 (2nd UK customer specced car by VIN). Originally from the Far East....of Anglia, I read black box data for a living so that could explain a lot!

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My understanding is that the true benefits come from matching the gas flow - I.e. Independant pipes for each cylinder would be perfect but impractical so a combination of diameter and length and shape is used to pass the same amount of gas from all cylinders. Shape will affect the speed of flow but the crucial factor is the volume of gas passed so that all cylinders are balanced.

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Mike S

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  • 2 months later...

It's been a few weeks now Since I fitted the BOE CAi, 2ubular back box and third cat delete and I can honestly say the car feels faster, even if it is not it certainly gives me and my co pilot something to talk about every time I plant it in second and third, the noise  is also immense, I think I have already mentioned this elsewhere,,,, but the main reason for this post is to see if you guys have seen the turbo n/a kit up for sale in the USA ? $8k for the whole kit, 400+ bhp.

might not be the best way but certainly gets you more power from the n/a!!!

 

 

 

oh here's the link , it looks and sounds cool, just not sure if the engine and drivetrain would last

https://www.facebook.com/Meghani-Motorsports-631214750339002/

Edited by Jmanji
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From the US forums I think a few of these have been sold and installed and seem to work well. Interested in why you don't think the engine and drivetrain would last, after all Komotecs 430bhp conversion seems just fine, though that does I warrant use the beefier clutch that comes with the S model as standard.

To be honest, if I wanted forced induction I'd just upgrade by swapping in my NA for an "S" variant. I like the fact the NA is just that, normally aspirated, and like the smooth way the power is delivered, just want a bit more of it ;) Though after taking the Evora out on Sunday, on shit wet/dirty roads, it did remind just how easy and lazy it is to build speed, and build it quickly when you plant the right foot on the loud pedal. More than enough for UK roads, probably not enough for tracks - but then it does spend 98% of its time on UK Roads.....

Provided I don't succomb to the idea of a 50:50 deal on a 400 (Easter at the earliest), the 2bular headers are next for me. Then an excuse to drive down to Essex for the remap and take in some driving on the Lotus Test Track and possibly the BOE CAI (or equivalent).  All told I should then have aound 320 - 325bhp to play with and with the lower weight an ever so slightly better power to weight ratio than the "S". I have the CR box already so performance should be quite similar.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • 2 weeks later...
On ‎10‎/‎12‎/‎2015 at 10:08, C8RKH said:

From the US forums I think a few of these have been sold and installed and seem to work well. Interested in why you don't think the engine and drivetrain would last, after all Komotecs 430bhp conversion seems just fine, though that does I warrant use the beefier clutch that comes with the S model as standard.

To be honest, if I wanted forced induction I'd just upgrade by swapping in my NA for an "S" variant. I like the fact the NA is just that, normally aspirated, and like the smooth way the power is delivered, just want a bit more of it ;) Though after taking the Evora out on Sunday, on shit wet/dirty roads, it did remind just how easy and lazy it is to build speed, and build it quickly when you plant the right foot on the loud pedal. More than enough for UK roads, probably not enough for tracks - but then it does spend 98% of its time on UK Roads.....

Provided I don't succomb to the idea of a 50:50 deal on a 400 (Easter at the earliest), the 2bular headers are next for me. Then an excuse to drive down to Essex for the remap and take in some driving on the Lotus Test Track and possibly the BOE CAI (or equivalent).  All told I should then have aound 320 - 325bhp to play with and with the lower weight an ever so slightly better power to weight ratio than the "S". I have the CR box already so performance should be quite similar.

Hi Andy

I have fitted the 2bular switched back box and love it but would like to get a "little" more power out of the NA. The headers seem the next step but any idea how much they would cost to fit? I did the tailpipe myself but don't fancy fighting the headers in my limited garage space...

Agreed fighting the 400 itch is the other problem, and that's before you consider the new V6 Exige, now that looks proper lovely, the new interior and gear change alone make it worth while....

C43

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My understanding is the headers are a pig to install and from what I could research I think budgeting around £700 for the fitting was not unrealistic.

Yes 400 itch is strong but still cannot get my man maths to accept it is worth £50k + my current car. I'm just gonna stay with my NA and "fettle" around with it as to be honest it is more than fast and capable enough for UK roads and I'm looking at getting into racing next year in some form. That'll provide the adrenalin rush better even than a 400 on UK roads tbh.

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • 1 month later...
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The Exige V6 boys have been discussing / evaluating a CAI from SSC in Australia - link below:

I've been in touch with SSC in Australia and they would be willing to do a Group Buy. This would include a discount and obviously saving on postage. I've checked with them and they say it will fit and work with the Evora NA and some information and pics below. Would anyone be interested? What do you want to know further about it? Stuart from SSC provided this update on the latest changes:

Also just to make you aware, we are developing a new mount to make the attachment on the backstay, At the moment it’s done simply through a few zip ties which may not look overly advanced but the system needs to have some level of compliance to account for the back stay not moving but the rocking of the engine. The new mount will be a tube clamp on the back stay which is then bolted to a rubber anti vibration mount which then has a bracket to mounting the induction pipe. I’ll supply you with the updated mounts as soon as they are available.

The instyallation pictures are of the part installed on V6 Exiges.

 

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  • Like 1

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8 February 2016 at 10:26, C8RKH said:

I've been in touch with SSC in Australia and they would be willing to do a Group Buy. This would include a discount and obviously saving on postage. I've checked with them and they say it will fit and work with the Evora NA and some information and pics below. Would anyone be interested? What do you want to know further about it?

Andy,

If you end up doing a Group Buy, could you please confirm that the CAI would also fit an Evora S? If so, I could be interested. I am currently 'evaluating' the various intake options.

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Jonny, yes, no problem at all. I would expect the answer back to be a strong yes as I believe the "SSC Induction" was developed for the Exige S - so essentially exactly the same engine as yours ;)

I've made the guys at SSC aware of this thread so, they may pop on and say Hi and provide some more info, though, I do know they are swamped with stuff at the moment.

 

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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  • 4 weeks later...

I don't know if you've seen this, but they seem to be claiming 325BHP from a N/A 2GR:

http://www.woodsport.org/joomla/index.php/engine-conversions/7-toyota-mr2-mk2-engine-conversions-/29-2gr-fe-conversion

Or if you're feeling a bit more spendy, how about some cams?

http://www.monkeywrenchracing.com/product_info.php?cPath=318&products_id=1930

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 years later...
On 16/04/2018 at 09:35, Del Lardo said:

Thanks for the update, very informative.  Back to random musings about headers and ECU update for my NA then :lol:

What are you 'musing' mate? I am doing similar... seems like a bit of a 'tumbleweed' area however... 

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Breathing seems to be the restriction on the NA with Headers being a restriction as standard due to the cats being there.  All of the replacement Headers remove the cats and replace them with a standalone cat further down.

Once replaced people have mentioned Essex Autosport as being able to tune the ECU for more power and I think Hangar111 do the same with their EV300 tune.  

ES Motorsport have also told me that they can now offer a ECU replacement http://elise-spares.com/index.php?route=product/product&filter_name=ecu&product_id=780 and tune that should see more power once breathing mods (CAI/exhaust) are installed. 

 

So my musing is a set of headers from Jim @ 2bular as I have his backbox installed and really like it and then getting one of the above to tune or replace the ECU for more POWER!!!!!!

Edited by Del Lardo
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@Del Lardo I had Jim's headers on my NA and they really do release some ponies in the mid range. The car just revs so much free'er and it sounds superb.

Sadly, Essex no longer do the ECU tune, the guy who did it for them is off working on his own ECU programme. However, i have heard very good things re ES Motorsports ( I believe that @Bravo73 has used them and is very happy ) and of course Hangar 111 could do the EV300 kit that includes headers - I would also add their Carbon CAI though as well. Great piece of kit.

Good luck with the upgrades :)

 

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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51 minutes ago, Del Lardo said:

Breathing seems to be the restriction on the NA with Headers being a restriction as standard due to the cats being there.  All of the replacement Headers remove the cats and replace them with a standalone cat further down.

 

FWIW, contrary to what a certain exhaust manufacturer wants people to think, the OEM headers aren’t actually that restrictive. All versions of the V6 engine (including the 430bhp versions) use the same headers so 300bhp shouldn’t be an issue. 

(The OEM headers, however, do have other issues - weight, heat management and potential cat ingestion being some of them). 

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