free hit
counters
Hello and some GT3 - Esprit - Elise Questions - Introductions - The Lotus Forums #ForTheOwners Jump to content


Hello and some GT3 - Esprit - Elise Questions


LW Elise

Recommended Posts

Hello from the other side of the pond.

As a true American I worked my way through the Vettes, Vipers, and finally a dream (nightmare) car, an 88 Ferrari Testarossa. Then I tried the long awaited US version of the Elise, and turned in the Testarossa the next day for my current Lotus Elise.

I have a leased Range Rover Sport, but have given much thought to consolidating to one car for both sports and daily driver. The Elise doesn't have enough of a boot (trunk) and getting in and out, particularly when it rains, is quite a job if one makes several stops in a day. But the lightness and handling takes me back to my TR4, MGB days of the 60s and 70s (I'm 56) for lightness, with better speed, brakes, and handling. Amazing little machine, actually. But if I could retain Colin Chapman "lightness" and get more power and a bit more daily usability, that would be great.

I was strongly considering going to the Porsche GT3, when someone on the Elise forum suggested that I might consider the upcoming Lotus Esprit instead. Assuming that will come to market for less US dollars than a Porsche GT3, and if you could have only one of the two (I can't afford an Esprit and a Porsche GT3-- used or not) which would you own and why?

Other suggestions as to vehicles are also welcome.

Edited by LW Elise
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Upgrade today to remove Google ads and support TLF.
  • Replies 17
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

I'm a bit confused here, you're an American talking about a GT3 (Esprit??). These cars were Euro spec 2.0L 4 pots and not sold in the States if memory serves. Are you based in the UK?

Or is it a Porsche GT3 you are referring to...

Personally I'd wait for the new Esprit if I had the money, its gonna be a beaut if my instinct serves me. Should be pretty solid with a BMW V8tt and box.

regards

Dom

I note that several people here own both GT3 and Elise. Other suggestions as to vehicles are also welcome.
Edited by DBredS4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm a bit confused here, you're an American talking about a GT3 (Esprit??). These cars were Euro spec 2.0L 4 pots and not sold in the States if memory serves. Are you based in the UK?

Or is it a Porsche GT3 you are referring to...

Personally I'd wait for the new Esprit if I had the money, its gonna be a beaut if my instinct serves me. Should be pretty solid with a BMW V8tt and box.

regards

Dom

My apologies, I meant the Porsche GT3 which is imported here. I edited my post above to correct that mistake. To my knowledge we were not able to gt the Esprit GT3. There is talk that we will get the new Esprit when it comes on line, and talk that we will be able to get the Exige Sport here, although that is not yet certain.

Whether I can afford the new Esprit or not is highly dependent on the price point they bring it in under.

If it is $100,000 American, it will lose market share to the GT3, and for comfort oriented people the Aston Martin, and the future NSX, I believe. If they come in under $100,000 American, they will be in Viper/ Corvette Z06 territory price wise, and will be far more exotic and interesting and should do very well.

Edited by LW Elise
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome to the forum, hope you get the answers you are looking for

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself.

Friedrich Nietzsche

find me on Tripadvisor

http://www.tripadvis...mbers/espritguy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi there, forget the Porsche and get one of these instead if you can't wait for the New Esprit.

http://www.noblecars.com/home.htm

Dunno how they get sold in the states, although I have seen a few over there.

M400 is the one to get imo or a push to the M15.

Light, corners on rails, power to pretty much humiliate anything in a straight line and in the corners/track days - fantastic cars.

facebook = [email protected]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good point Jon - but I tested a Noble (M12?) for my radio programme a few months ago. Don't get me wrong, it was the greatest buzz I'd had in a car in ages, but it didn't have the magic of a sorted Esprit.

Maybe it was too track-focused - felt like there was no rubber in the bushes (probably all rose-jointed), gearbox whine was intrusive, and being a lard-ass made the seat uncomfortable fairly quickly.

The Esprit by comparison might lack that raw energy and naked aggression, but I think it's a much better road car, more evolved, better looking and with a reasonably luxurious and comfortable interior.

Of course, in an ideal world a Noble would sit alongside Lottie, the Ariel Atom, Caterham R400 and all the others. But just one? Lottie for me.

Proud recipient of the LEF 'Car of the Month Award' February 2008

"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: "Wow, what a ride!!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good point Jon - but I tested a Noble (M12?) for my radio programme a few months ago. Don't get me wrong, it was the greatest buzz I'd had in a car in ages, but it didn't have the magic of a sorted Esprit.

Maybe it was too track-focused - felt like there was no rubber in the bushes (probably all rose-jointed), gearbox whine was intrusive, and being a lard-ass made the seat uncomfortable fairly quickly.

The Esprit by comparison might lack that raw energy and naked aggression, but I think it's a much better road car, more evolved, better looking and with a reasonably luxurious and comfortable interior.

Of course, in an ideal world a Noble would sit alongside Lottie, the Ariel Atom, Caterham R400 and all the others. But just one? Lottie for me.

Driving the Lotus Elise currently, and I was one of the few who felt comfortable in the Viper seats, so I'm not too worried about the lard ass/comfort part.

I would be worried about finding quality mechanics for the Noble in the US. As it is, Lotus doesn't exactly have a fine US based mechanic network, but at least the Elise has Yamaha/Toyota bits so it isn't too tough, and everything else just rattles until it falls off :-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Depends on where you are in the States LW - we have lots of forum members in the Colonies who can advise you on good specialists there for the major jobs - and as long as you specify materials and fluids etc (buy the Lotus factory manuals) any competent local shop can do the mundane stuff.

I'm no mechanic, but there seem to be few REALLY different things on an Esprit that a local spanner monkey wouldn't understand with the aid of the proper service manuals - and this place is a WEALTH of expertise in best practice. Only last week, Rens pointed out something I hadn't realised about fitting new bushes, for example...

Proud recipient of the LEF 'Car of the Month Award' February 2008

"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: "Wow, what a ride!!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi LW and welcome to the forum. :)

What didnt you like about the Testarossa? :o

Ferrari was my dream car. The Testarossa became the pinnacle of GTs with the marque having a wildly romantic racing heritage. I traded a 2003 Viper in to purchase a beautiful red over biscuit 88 Testarossa, in apparently perfect shape with 17,000 miles on it. The next day a red light came on saying "1-6". That was an ECU warning for cylinders 1-6. The dealer advised that replacing that ECU was between $1500 and $2500 depending on soucing the part. They paid for that. Nice of them.

Then I was advised that despite the car having 17,000 miles, the number of years since the 15,000 mile service was such that I needed to do the 30,000 mile service. The Ferrari Chat board members confirmed that I needed to do that or risk serious engine failure if the BELTs driving the cams failed from age.

How much? $10,000 US. I was going to pay the first half, and the dealer would absorb the second half.

Why so much? The engine must come out of the car to reach the belts. The tune up took 3 weeks. While it was out, the mechanic suggested that I have the water pump rebuilt even though it was not faulty. Reason?

Because if it DID go bad, it would require removing the engine to repair it. Cost? An additional $650 US

My bill? $6200 with tax.

NOW my Ferrari was PERFECT. Bad range on driving lights, like my Elise. 4000 pounds driven by 390 horsepower, so much weaker than my former Viper. Slower than an EVO, Elise, or many other vehicles.

Very, very wide. Shifting was fun because it was difficult to get the gates done correctly, and no using second gear until the oil was warm. But the car was BEAUTIFUL. So I was happy.

Dead battery quite a bit. Bought a new one. Rock into a turn signal cover. Bought a new plastic cover. $165.

Couldn't park in the neighborhood I take Aikido. Couldn't park anywhere marginal for fear of damage.

Two months later. Red light: "7-12" Now I'm off the dealer assistance period. How much? Same as "1-6" Why didn't they replace the second ECU at the same time as the first? They don't necessarily go out AT THE SAME TIME. Cost? I didn't pay it but it would have been between $1500 and 2500. The dealer ended up paying that as part of my trade "down" into the Elise.

Go to drive the car in to the shop and it starts dying. Problem? Ignition coil. Thank goodness. I've replaced many of those, and this should be cheap. Dealer charge that I did pay? $1500.

But now the warning is, you may have spilled raw gas into your catalytic converters if the ECU isn't bad, and when we test it, they may burn out. Price for the PARTS of replacing? $7,000 US

I left the car, keys, and my attitude at the dealer, and walked out with the keys, warranty, and ownership of my Elise. That was June. They spent a fair amount more sorting out the Testarossa, and as of the other day, still had it for sale. It is probably PERFECT now. But I no longer care. I got the Elise because it was the only marque they had on the lot that I could drive out with clear title on, warranty, and keys and tax paid off, and repair bills left with the dealer, that they sold. I was going to trade that in for a Porsche GT3 or possibly a Vette Z06, but all of a sudden something odd happened.

My 1000 mile cost $374. That ain't cheap for a glorified oil change, but by comparison it was a walk in the park. And the car reminds me of my TR4A, MGB, Datsun 1600s, and so on of my teenage years. I look forward to every drive in the car, although I don't look forward to getting in and out. I've "decided" to get the Esprit when it gets out because the more I read about Colin Chapman and performance through light weight, the more I buy into the concept.

Suddenly I'm wondering if the Exige S will be imported into the US. That will be even harder to get into and out of than my Elise, but hey........... maybe it would be worth it. Now I want to know if I can get enough cooling air into the supercharger, and into the engine air if I take the top off of an Exige S, if I can get one into the US. I"ve been infected with the Lotus fever. My screensaver is an Exige with the top off that someone posted a picture of.

I'm an old guy (56) and I'm acting like a child. I want the extra downforce of the Exige. I don't need it.

The truth is that I think the wing looks really cool, and I like the blacked out wheels. And I want the 218 horsepower direct from Lotus engineering instead of aftermarket. I don't need it. But I love having the top off (permanently when it isn't raining) on the Elise. Lotus fever has taken the mind of another Yank!

That much I can thank Ferrari for. : - )

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Welcome to the forum LW Elisw/e (?)

I can believe your Testarossa experience. There was an article on buying a used Lamborghini Espada in a recent issue of Octane, I think. Anyhoo, each thing that could go wrong seemed to cost 2500 or 3000 pounds to fix. Unless it was serious, in which case it was a lot more.

S4 Elan, Elan +2S, Federal-spec, World Championship Edition S2 Esprit #42, S1 Elise, Excel SE

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But now the warning is, you may have spilled raw gas into your catalytic converters if the ECU isn't bad, and when we test it, they may burn out. Price for the PARTS of replacing? $7,000 US

:lol:

Oh well, they can burn out and the next driver can have the extra 60 HP they free up...

feck paying whatever ridiculous figure they quoted.. they can sing for it

utter over priced tat...........

pretty looking cars though.

I have just realised how Ferrari stay in F1 what with Schumackers sky high fees...

Edited by DBredS4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

hi,

welcome to you on this Esprit Team Forum.

the best choice Esprit : between the S1 until the near futur one you can find the answer to your driving dream and with extra bonus the Soul Lotus.No one in the world of F1/sport cars buiders can give you that.

Patrick: 78480 km on a S4 until to day and more to morrow and where she takes me away is only with her I can go.

"Aut tace aut loquere meliora silentio" Salvator Rosa when 25 years old National Gallery London

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi L W Elise,

Glad to see you that you have seen sense and joined all the "beautiful people" with a Lotus (although if you look at some of the pictures from our day at Hethel you might disagree with that :D ).

I just thought I should mention to you that we were discussing the Exige S with one of the main guys on the assembly line and he said that taking the roof off the Exige completely ruined the feel of the car as you lose so much stiffness. He couldn't understand why people did it especially with all the extra power in the S.

So, if you do get one don't be too quick to get that roof off!

Welcome to the forum by the way,

Richard

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi L W Elise,

Glad to see you that you have seen sense and joined all the "beautiful people" with a Lotus (although if you look at some of the pictures from our day at Hethel you might disagree with that :D ).

I just thought I should mention to you that we were discussing the Exige S with one of the main guys on the assembly line and he said that taking the roof off the Exige completely ruined the feel of the car as you lose so much stiffness. He couldn't understand why people did it especially with all the extra power in the S.

So, if you do get one don't be too quick to get that roof off!

Welcome to the forum by the way,

Richard

Thanks for the info. That will never do. 1500 miles on the Elise. Only had one tail light fall out and the allen screws from the emergency brake handle. So far, so good :D Now if I lose a few more pounds/stone, and stretch a bit more, I'll get used to getting in and out. Probably save me about $75,000 American..... :D .... as we await the $100K plus Esprit in 09.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What about the new Europa? Have you considered it? :D

Thanks for the info. That will never do. 1500 miles on the Elise. Only had one tail light fall out and the allen screws from the emergency brake handle. So far, so good :D Now if I lose a few more pounds/stone, and stretch a bit more, I'll get used to getting in and out. Probably save me about $75,000 American..... :( .... as we await the $100K plus Esprit in 09.

Caught between a rock and a hard place in a catch 22 situation, So its 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. Your damned if you do, but your damned if you don't so shut your cock!!!!!!!!!!!

Lotus Espirt Turbo S3    

Lotus Esprit S4 

Lotus Elise S2 Sport 130

pig_zps6d7342f1.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi LW

I got to drive a supercharged Exige at the Lotus Drivers' Club Track Day in April this year. 240-odd horsepower, I think they said - and in a car that didn't weigh much more than my right shoe. It was astonishingly quick, and the unearthly shriek from the supercharger just made my hair stand on end. It was so intoxicating to drive, and so wildly capable beyond my driving skills.

Then we swapped seats, and Dave Minter (Lotus Engineer and Racing Instructor) took me for a couple of flying laps.

I still can't get that stain out of my trousers...

...but I didn't stop grinning for a week.

I'd like to give you some feedback on how easy it was to get in and out of the car, but I truly can't remember. Sorry.

Welcome to the forum, LW.

Ben

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...