Europa - did anyone NOT like it ?

[oneshot]

Well you can't have my 350 for that price

I ain't about to sell it anyway.

[Loose Cannon]

Feeling a bit peeved after reading all this postivity not having booked a test drive. Although the press photos probably did not do it any favours the thing I would be concerned over is the packaging. This is being sold as a sports tourer but luggage space is limited. The front looks full of radiators and the boot would struggle with a few weekend bags. The Esprit feels like an American station wagon by comparison. Lotus needs an Excel size platform to truly expand its range.

Edited October 10, 2006 by britten_mark

[Red]

can't wait to see what TG make of it.

TBH, I'm more nervous than excited. Clarkson is very brutal with his opinions, a lot of people listen to him and agree just to sound like they know as much as him, he'll exagerate a problem if he can make a funny quip of it, he can level a cars chances of sucess with one word (Coxter anyone?) and he's tall.

He's tall, and he might not like getting in and out and the proximity of the gearstick in 5th and 6th. If that riles him, or he's having a bad day, he might call it uncomfortable and impractical still. Top Gears opinion is important, maybe not to people on here who will do their own research on a Lotus, but to the masses certainly.

I hope he likes it, but I'm still nervous!

[Jonathan]

For

[Bibs]

I had my Europa from Saturday afternoon to Sunday afternoon so lived with it on 4 trips from Hethel/Norwich to Yarmouth which was about 170 miles all in.

Although the fuel economy is poor (erm, I got 130 miles from a tank the car was great fun! The boot is adequate for luggage (2 people, 3 days worth of stuff) and although I was a little cramped with 5th/6th too I didn't find it a problem I couldn't live with.

The engine is sublime when matched up with the six speed box. Great torque delivery and very well spaced gears meaning you can remain in the power band on a variety of roads and situations. It has incredibly precise steering although perhaps a little too light at times but the ride/suspension is spot on.

I was a little distracted by the angle of the rear screen which reflects the heater/stereo into the mirror at night and is quiet distracting but when you're heading along the A47 at, erm, quiet some speed what's behind you is pretty irrelevant!

The driving experience was Lotus through and through. I felt at home in the car straight away and really enjoyed my time with it. Tony and I had pre-production PR cars so there were a few build issues which as I understand are now all fully corrected. My car was the one Clarkson had been ragging to death the day before I had it which perhaps could have contribution to the minor coolant hose problem but the car was, in my overall opinion, very impressive.

Would I buy one if I had the cash and wanted a usable GT car. Yes.

[Paul C]

Did ya drive it !?

No.

But then i've never worn a dress, they are probably very comfortable

and doubtless would keep me cooler in the summer months, it's just the

looks that stop me.

I assume it drives superbly as it's a lotus after all, i simply don't like it's

looks at all, and i'd be nuts to pay £30k for a car don't like looking at.

There's probably a long list of cars that are very nice to drive that people

would not buy due to other reasons, don't mean there is anything wrong

with the car mate, by all accounts it will go down very well.

I really do want it too!

[matk]

I drove it and am probably in the minority in not wanting one. Everyone says how much easier it is to access than an Elise and I must admit I haven't driven an Elise, but I still found it awkward to get in and out of, too narrow inside and quite frankly I don't think I could live with one on a daily basis.

Having said that I thougt it was superb to drive, and I came out of the car with a huge smile on my face and along with everyone else I really DO hope it sells by the bucket load.

Conclusions? Well the prob I have is that I couldn't use it on a daily basis which leaves it for me a potential weekend toy. Unfortunately if I was looking for another weekend toy at the price I think I'd rather suffer the same issues but do it in a nearly new Exige! Finally I also thought it looked crap in the photos, but MUCH better in the flesh.

[Evil_Dr_Fish]

I do have a genuine complaint I am prepeared to stand by as not being 'just me' (eg gearshift!)

There is NOWHERE to rest you arm. This is supposed to be a long distance tourer and there's no centre console for your left arm and then the window sill is waaay too high (like the Esprit)

However... unlike the Esprit you cannot rest your arm on the door as it is angled very steeply down.

If you're 'full on driving' and hooning you have both arms out in fornt of you and it's not an issue.

This is being touted as a touring car tho and I very quickly found the lack of an elbow rest a real pain even in that short a time!

[RichardN]

This may be old news but I have just read the November TG magazine and they had a right old go at the Europa. Didn't really give it much of a chance and seemed to take against if from the moment they picked it up.

They admitted that it gave you a grin from ear to ear to drive but seemed to hate everything else.

Personally I have to admit I thought it drove brilliantly, more like a go-cart than anything else although I haven't driven an Elise/Exige to compare it it to.

I'm still not sure on the looks. As many have said it looked a lot better in the flesh than photos but I cannot get passed those headlights. I really don't like them and they rather stand out as you look at the car.

Would I buy one? I would have to try the others first but I would like to get more time in one. Perhaps I should set up an incredibly successful forum, run it for a few years and then organise a factory visit - nah, sounds like far too much work. It would be easier to find the £32,000

Richard

[Jonathan]

There is NOWHERE to rest you arm. This is supposed to be a long distance tourer and there's no centre console for your left arm and then the window sill is waaay too high (like the Esprit)

However... unlike the Esprit you cannot rest your arm on the door as it is angled very steeply down.

If you're 'full on driving' and hooning you have both arms out in fornt of you and it's not an issue.

Now hang on, sit down - ready ?

I totally agree with you ! (and I overlooked it)

I pretty much always drive 2 hands on the wheel unless I'm picking nose or changing gear or both and when In the Esprit I always rest my elbows on the tunnel and the door - lay back and let the car do the work when cruising.

The Elise I've doen a few LONG journeys and I always end up shaking my arms to get life back into them, however the Europa was MUCH more stable at very high speed (the S1 Elise you have to lock arms at 80) - but you're right you need something to rest your arms on when not in Lotus mode.

The prob is where to put it - there is no room for a centre console like that becuase of the chassis beams either side of the seats....if you make room you further compromise the chassis which will detract from the ride and handling

It's never going to be flawless but with what they have it's damn good.

Interesting to hear what Bibs thought, pretty much fully respect your opinion on cars, but don't try and tell me Clarkson broke it

[Red]

Funny thing was I was looking at the doors of the Europa on Monday and wondering why they couldn't follow the outside line on the inside, which would give you a nice shelf for your arm and make the cabin feel that bit bigger. I'm sure the answer is that the windows and their mechanism gets in the way, but I think it was a surmountable problem

[Evil_Dr_Fish]

Yes it's hard to know without removing the card if it's like that due to 'door contents' or purely styling... If it's purely styling, then that angle needs turning into an elbow shelf asap!

[Kimbers]

Both Bibsy and me had the car for a few days and you really do not notice the arm rest thing.

As many have said, I think the press just don't understand the Europa. It's not a GT and the only persona to describe it so is no longer at the factory.

I REALLY REALLY think you should drive said Europa followed by Elise just to see what a huge improvement on getting in and out and everyday driving it is!

[th4neuk]

I only have 3 things that struck me on the test drive that I didn't like.

1 - the seats are quite hard for daily use. I would assume the audi tt is in the firing line for this type of car and the seats in that are far better.

2- it needs more room inside. I'm not that big and the guy who took me for the drive wasn't huge but there wasn't much room between us.

3 - the throw of the gear change was too long. It felt like it need a quickshift kit or something.

I'm not a huge lover of the styling but it went well and handled well. I was surprised how well it drove tbh.

Just my 2p. Nice they gave us a drive though.

Cheers

[SwissV8]

Both Anita and myself had a test drive. Anita had an MR2, and loved the S2000 I had... and now she loves the Europa...... "I'd have one" she said, straight after the test drive!

I certainly found the test drive interesting! On the positive side, it handled beautifully, was very responsive in all gears, and the ride quality was excellent - much easier to live with as a daily drive than the S1 Elise I had.

The only things I wasn't so convinced with were the gearchange (to long, light and a little imprecise for my taste), and the general interior trim quality - although I'm told these were all early production prototypes, and the interior quality has now been improved.

In comparision to my Boxster S, there's no question that the Europa is way more driver focussed, handles and responds superbly, and puts a massive smile on ya face when you drive it - the Porky takes a different aproach, has very high build quality, huge comfort, extremely practical for a two seater, and goes pretty well too.

So to me, it doesn't seem like there's anything else around that's really a direct competitor/comparison for the Europa. The Europa offers a true Lotus sports car experience, polished off with a more relaxed ride and drivability - the "competitors" offer an everyday, more luxurious car with a strong sporting twist.

... well, that's my view at least!

... oh, and in case it wasn't clear.... I loved the Europa test drive as well

[Evil_Dr_Fish]

That's really interesting to read - someone else who felt teh same as I about the gearchange! :)I really thought I'd be alone in that one - my personal conclusion was that it would feel more positive if it was say spring loaded?

As for the arm rest, with all due respect Tony - you can't say I didn't notice it as I DID! Within about 2 minutes I was already unhappy about not being able to relax my arms comfortably - and others seem to have agreed!

Ok I can't say that it bothered you - as clearly it didn't but I was already feeling it!

If the best I can come up with as criitcisms of the car are the gearchange being however most other people seem to like it (just not me!) and something as easily remedied as no arm rest in the door card, then it has really not got much to worry about!

[Red]

You said maybe it was your car Fishy, so maybe Rob drove the same one? Would say more positive things for the model if it was just that one.

Also, when the Elise came out there was nothing to point at and say it was a competitor to. It was unique, but Lotus hit the nail on the head and it sold. From what I was told on the day the Europa is the same in that it's not targeted against anything. It's designed for the people who wimp out of getting an Elise because it's a bit too impractical for every day driving and go buy from another marque.

[Evil_Dr_Fish]

Hi Red... No I didn't say it wasn't just my car - I said I felt sure it was just ME!!

It felt the same as my mate's Vectra GSi (which stands to reason) and I'm not keen on the gearshift either - Just doesn't feel 'positive' enough for me. A simple spring load around it would remedy it imho.

[mayevora]

Loved the Europa and hope it sells buckets. Took me a long time to climb in and out and couldn't use 5 and 6 as knees in the way. If only I was a foot and a half shorter.

[Kimbers]

Loved the Europa and hope it sells buckets. Took me a long time to climb in and out and couldn't use 5 and 6 as knees in the way. If only I was a foot and a half shorter.

For those that didn't meet Ian he was the giant who made my dad look small! You could also find him surgically attached to the bar area with me and Bibs!

[Red]

If only I was a foot and a half shorter.

Most people are!

[Evil_Dr_Fish]

Except Troy!

He picked up that one and ran with it!

[martynv]

I thought the low down torque was very impresive and the acceleration so progressive. It seemed in all the gears I got the chance to use a gentle press of the accelerator spun up the turbo with a rally car like whistle and the car just glided off with superb acceleration. The car handles really well too on that winding road just before you turn off for the factory I drove the whole length from the round about without touching the brake once. My only minor gripe would be that since I'm not very tall is that the steering wheel was a little too high for me unlike in the Esprit where its almost at a perfect height.

Martyn B)

[th4neuk]

I'm withyou on the gear change fishy. I drove the silver one so not sure if it is just that car. The throw felt way too long.

Cheers

[USAndretti42]

It seems a real shame the Europa will not be sold in the States as all the reviewers seem to love the Elise but complain it is too hardcore and not suitable for day-to-day use. Sounds like the Europa would answer these criticisms while having all the driving fun of the Elise. Damn those regulations.