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Retrofitting a chargecooler - Induction/Turbo/Chargecooler/Manifold/Exhaust - The Lotus Forums Jump to content
Corban

Retrofitting a chargecooler

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Hi,

 

I have a MY88 Esprit Turbo fitted with twin dellortos. I am planning to fit a chargecooler to the engine. Anyone here with experience of this mod? I have bought an original chargecooler, a cam cover with the oil filler cap moved towards the front and the "nozzle" that fits between ch.cooler and intake plenum. When I turn this part (nozzle) upside down there are two hose connections and two small holes that seem to be connected to each other. I do have the workshop manual but it doesn't cover the chargecooler installation. What do they do, or what should be connected to them?

The chargecooler is mostly self explanatory but there is a hole before the last bend, where the air leaves the cooling coil. Looks like it is used for a sensor or similar and there is a small connection for a water hose next to the water out connection. I guess this goes to the header tank?

 

The plan looks like this:

Fit a separate radiator behind right rear wheel, under the floor of the trunk (plenty of space). This shortens the routing of hoses considerably.

Fit a separate header tank and an electric pump.

 

I might need to protect the radiator with some kind of mesh, maybe fit a cooling fan to it or an air scope.

 

All input welcome!

 

//Henrik

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Hi Henrik,

 

I'm thinking about chargecoooling my 88 carb turbo at some stage as well. I've had no joy in sourcing an original Lotus chargecooler so may consider one made by Alunox.

 

Interested to know why you are considering mounting a rad at the rear of the car. Is this because you are planning to retain the A/C assuming yours is fitted with A/C? I've heard people have utilised the A/C pipework and condenser radiator to serve as the chargecooler raidiator by removing the A/C. Not sure how efficient the A/C condensing rad is but it could always be changed and just the pipework utilised.

 

I appreciate what you are saying about keeping pipework short but I would think that a greater volume of water would allow for more efficient cooling.

 

Just my thoughts on the subject.

 

Jeremy.

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Hi Jeremy,

I guess I was lucky sourcing a chargecooler by just asking a known lotus tuner if he had one laying around. My tip, look for people who have uprated to an after market chargecooler, they will have one original extra :-) Otherwise check this out (this was my next option) http://www.chargecooler.co.uk/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=72. Unsure how much space it uses.

My AC is working so I don't want to ruin it. Not knowing how much power this gives I am reluctant to dismantle the fan/radiator duct and fit a separate radiator, threading the hoses through the chassie only to find it doesn't work. If it works well and I can feel the oomph from the chargecooler I will consider making the installation as close to the original as possible (still use electric pump).
It would be really nice if the people who changed their AC to a chargecooler radiator could post on this forum and give some advice about retrofitting a chargecooler to a MY88 :-)

 

I've read Glyn Harper's owner page, that is what inspired me :-)

I want more detail of how it was done!

Edited by Corban

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Thanks Henrik, good point regarding people looking to upgrade their current chargecoolers who may be looking to sell their old one. I'll keep searching.

 

I'd looked at the AVT PWR chargecoolers as well. Not sure how they would compare money and efficiency wise but as you point out getting one to fit would be more a challenge.

 

Thanks for mentioning about the cam cover needing to be one with the cap at the front if using a standard chargecooler.

 

Do you know whether a standard chargecooler will fit under an 88 carb turbo engine cover without mods?

 

Jeremy.

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I am not sure about the engine cover yet. I got the chargecooler today so I haven't checked it out. I have a faint memory about reading somewhere that it will fit. Otherwise I can feel the smell of my angle grinder :)

Check out http://www.ramspott-brandt.de/ they have aftermarket chargecoolers for the Esprit. They don't come cheap but the company, if asked nicely, might know who ordered one and therefore might have a spare original.

About the engine cover, I have felt that the rfg cover is a bit heavy and I have thought about making my own from aluminum sheet metal to save some weight. 

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In answer to your initial questions, the 2 holes are for the secondary injectors, the hole after the rad is for the MAT (Mass Air Temp) sensor and the small pipe is a return to the header tank :)

 

Not sure how much airflow you'll see under the boot, you'll be wanting to dump a lot of heat so you need a lot of air passing through the rad.

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So on the fuel injected SE they injected extra fuel in the inlet tract at the chargecooler. Is that because it just provided a location to put the injectors on the inlet as opposed to having to modify other parts of the inlet?

 

My thoughts as well regarding boot mounting a rad for the chargecooler. Lotus put it up front for good reason to take advantage of the extra airflow and thus extra cooling upfront.

 

I guess the inherent challenge with a mid engine car is that you end up having to mount alot upfront to provide adequate cooling but the downside is extra weight and complexity (but you just get great handling which makes it all worth while).

 

On the exige of course they put a large scoop on the roof to feed air to the intercooler, a big scoop on an esprit, now that would look just daft :rambo:

 

Jeremy.

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Opinion, retro fitting a charge cooler is a lot of pain for not much gain. I turned my boost pressure up to 12 psi, goes like all hell.

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Thats only 0.8 bar. So with a chargecooler you could keep the inlet charge cool enough to maintain 1bar a lot longer. Its not a question of simply uping the boost. You need to keep the charge cold enough to maintain it and you'll need to make fueling adjustments aswell or youll be running lean. And everyone knows the big bang theory...

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According to service notes, I have a protection system that turns ignition of at 0.71 bar, so I guess this must be overridden. I have been thinking about raising boost pressure the last days, thinking that maybe chargecooler alone didn't give the SE all the extra power, but more along the lines that cooling the air gives the possibility to raise boost. Fitting a valve to the hose that controls wastegate or will changing the length of the control rod be enough? How to change the 0.71 bar protection to something higher? Don't want to take it away entirely. I will NOT fiddle with boost BEFORE the chargecooler is installed. Could anyone please post pictures of the forward mount for the chargecooler and how it is fitted?

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At 0.8, the entire chassis starts to distort when I lay it down hard, and I very rarely get the chance to do it.

It's winter here now and out early the other morning you could feel the benefit of cold air. A charge cooler is a compromise at best, doesn't mean it's no good, but the plumbing and then the air flow around 1 engine radiator, 2 oil coolers, 1 air-con, and then charge cooler.

It's only an opinion, but I can't see the value in a retro fit, now if it was there, yes please.

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the entire chassis starts to distort when I lay it down hard

 

You think? What are the symptoms?

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Ya need to keep an eye on the solid rocket booster O-rings too.

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On my '89 non-SE, I bought a new 2-in-1 chargecooler/ air con condenser radiator and bolted it down in place of the existing air con condenser. This pushed the large single oil cooler forward, and the only way I could mount it was to invert it and attach to the upper radiator duct JUST behind the wire mesh at the radiator entry.

This actually worked well enough for the street and the mild air temps where I live, but the fact that the chargecooler radiator air was being heat polluted by the oil cooler just in front of it bothered me, so eventually I changed all the plastic out and made a complete S4 front end (and rear end) conversion with the 2 oil coolers.

Trying out the engine without any secondary enrichment, while using the stock GM #707 EFI computer and a functioning chargecooler system did NOT work very well. I believe the engine went dead lean even using standard boost levels.

The next day I enabled an aftermarket secondary injector controller system (GReddy Rebic) and that sorted the fuel out. 

Later on I ditched the #707 computer and injector driver for a #708-- the SE computer.

So--

It's a little bit faster with the chargecooler on, but you should be prepared to add fuel to feed the extra ponies. 

When you up the boost, it's a LOT faster. I'm running 1.2 bar now with a sport 300 head and a hybrid turbo, etc.

 

Don't think I heard anybody mention the flat plate that goes between the funnel shaped diffusor and the plenum box. The SE has this plate to locate the the business end of the secondary injectors so they can spray into the plenum.

 

 

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Nice to get some info from someone who has retrofitted a chargecooler. The radical changes needed to the radiator assembly upfront is something I'm trying to avoid until I know there is some real power gain in this modification. Planning to place it as picture shows.
post-17332-0-15068900-1402476172.jpg
Sounds like I will need to add extra fuel somehow and increase boost to release the extra ponies. No secondary injectors in my plenum since I have the carbs. Any suggestions on how to increase boost and override 0.71bar safety device? I have seen some kind of valve that could be fitted to the hose to the wastegate where it is possible to adjust how much pressure is bled off (not reaching the WG).

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forget the carbs, throttle body fuel injection is your answer. controlls your timing and fuel, no need for a 5th injector and with a inlet air temp sensor after the chargecooler you can monitor the temp drop and change your timing if the air gets too hot or drops turbo. pressure (google kdfi) 

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You think? What are the symptoms?

It's called torque, exposing the Achilles heal of the backbone chassis.

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We know what it's called Roger, the problem is I think we are all struggling to understand how "the entire chassis starts to distort when I lay it down hard" running only 0.8 bar, when a virtually identical S4S & V8 twin turbo etc chassis seems to cope with huge amounts of extra power and torque fine.

It's the first time I've ever heard someone say that their chassis distorts when they put their foot down....

Edited by Simon350S

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Any suggestions on how to increase boost and override 0.71bar safety device? I have seen some kind of valve that could be fitted to the hose to the wastegate where it is possible to adjust how much pressure is bled off (not reaching the WG).

 

Not super familiar with the 88 wastegate system but if it has a pressure line from the plenum, (or whatever) down to the wastegate actuator on the wastegate, it should be possible to insert an aftermarket boost controller --HKS, Gizzmo, etc,. in there and control it electronically---they function by  just bleeding the the signal air off into space too.

 

 

 

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I think you are right lotus-62 :) I have a complete SAAB Trionic system that I can use. It is for 2.3litre, 4 pot, turbo charged engine so it should be in the right ball park ( I even think the spacing between injectors from the common rail is correct). What is deterring me at the moment is fitting things like "knock sensor", "crank shaft sensor" and some other stuff. Think I will need to remove the engine and dismantle it to fit these things so it will have to wait until the engine needs a restoration anyway, but YES, fuel injection is the way to go I think.

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