Potential Esprit Owner

[Projectblue]

Hello folks,

 

Just a sort of another intro (slightly more specific that my general one on the intro's page).

 

As a petrolhead I felt it was my duty to own a Lotus at some point and having driven an Elise Mk1 a while ago on a corporate track day, I realised that I couldn't get out of one with the roof on without just tipping myself out on to the concrete.

Since then I have been narrowing down the field of potential contenders for Projectblue's garage and of course the 911 sits there. Like the elephant in the room, ticking all the boxes except the one that mattered to me. Heart. What does float my boat, on so many levels, is the Esprit. Specifically V8, post 2001 (went to round rear lights?). I'm open to others, but that's my preference so far.

 

So that's what I'm here to learn about. The pro's/cons and to keep an eye on the for sale ads. Having been around on a number of special marque/model sites when I've owned them, I know from experience they are the best place to learn and contribute. What you can learn here, saves thousands ££ in buying and owning. 

 

Thanks for the help in advance, and reading this far without dozing off or going to make a cup of tea! (coffee if you are Stateside).

 

Cheers

Dave

 

 

 

[Vanya]

Straight off the bat, get ready for a long search if you want a good car unless you are referred to a particular example by someone knowledgeable about the Esprit. Some people have waited for years for the right car, some of us have gotten very lucky. Some less so.

 

Ideally, aim for a car that has been taken care of - there are lots of people out there who buy the Esprit as a summer fling, and then sell it off come autumn/winter. A brief chat on the phone will tell you what kind of owner they are. Dealerships are generally clueless from my experience and they'll usually just duck your questions and tell you "come on over it looks fantastic!". A car that has had its fluids (especially oils) changed annually is preferable.

 

Getting a car with as complete a service history as possible is a plus - preferably from a long-time owner who has been confident about doing the work themselves and who knows what HAS been done and where there is room for improvement. A service book full of stamps of course isn't a 100% guarantee  - some members on here have gone to see FSH cars which drove like dogs and leaked like sieves during the test drive...

 

I wouldn't get hung up on mileage or number of owners all things considered - a regularly driven Esprit is a happy Esprit.

 

With respect to the V8 extra care should be taken - on the whole, the 918 engine isn't as robust as the 4-cylinder engine, add to that a mismatched gearbox and you could have trouble. Early V8s (up to and including 1999MY that I've heard of) had issues with cylinder liners - these engines were mostly replaced under warranty, and the problem is a well known one, but aside from this some 918s were better put together than others. Hopefully service history or the current owner will be able to put your mind at ease in this regard.

 

Honestly, I don't know if there is a safe way to go about buying a V8 Esprit other than getting one that is known by the community - some people have been through several some very good others very costly. I think Hedgerly could chime in on this. Factory standard catalysts are crap - stainless aftermarket sport cats are less prone to crumbling and blocking the exhaust.

 

Some general Esprit tips are however:

Fuel Tanks: have the fuel tanks been replaced? - a smell of fuel around the boot area and while driving with the windows down CAN be an indicator that rust has eaten away at the tanks resulting in leaks. Getting the tanks replaced with alloy ones is a huge plus and one less thing to worry about. The smell could also just be breather hoses or a hose to the roll-over valve (cheap fix!).

 

Engine:

If you're looking at a 4-cylinder car, when was the exhaust manifold last replaced? Are there any signs it's on its way out? This is another quasi-expensive fact-of-life job the Esprit has to live with but I wouldn't call it a deal breaker.

 

Cooling:

If 4-cylinder: does the chargecooler pump work? Immediately after a drive, the chargecooler should be cool to the touch. Boost failing to rise above 0.7 bar with the engine and coolant at operating temperature is an indicator the impellor might be shot. Not an expensive fix, but you'll need to get your hands dirty.

If a V8: does it run very hot when in traffic? The V8's seem quite prone to ineffective cooling and clogged radiators...

 

Suspension components: depending on how many miles the car has done, suspension bushes, springs & dampers should probably be replaced. A car with a recently performed geometry check and a chart to prove it can save you having to rebuild components that have become bent due to going over potholes etc etc.

 

Steering - for non PAS cars, is there a lot of play in the steering? This might indicate a worn rack or U-Joints. Not a tough job by any means but I'd say common with non power assisted cars.

 

Windows - a lot of Esprits I've seen have very lazy windows indicating worn switches or the need for a window motor overhaul. Good to check out. Rebuilding the motor on my Turbo SE was a doddle, but it depends on how "hands on" you want to be.

 

What I'd have done differently....

If I could go back and choose which car to buy I would probably have ensured the above points were considered and gone for an S4 or S4s - specifically the latter. The build quality of the S4s is generally regarded as the high point in the Esprit's history - you get the swollen wheel arches, wheels and rear wing of a V8, but instead with an engine that is essentially indestructable - There's a chat ongoing about the 2.2 910 engine which you might want to look at but general consensus is that it has very few genuine flaws other than the manifold.

 

What's more the chassis and suspension improvements post Turbo SE (S4 onwards) make for a better ride, and the seats and ergonomics were vastly improved.

 

As a result of its reputation and robustness the S4s is an appreciating asset and getting one in good nick is going to be expensive and only getting more so in future. The time to buy is now...

 

The V8, in my opinion, was a bit let down by poor assembly at the factory - I've heard of strange failures like cars throwing conrods due to loose big-end bolts and other such tales which I've never heard happening to the 4-cylinder cars. A properly functioning V8 Esprit is wonderful however - compared to the Turbo SE I have, it's a real Grand Tourer - from an NVH perspective it's no contest - it's a lot more civilized than an earlier Stevens Esprit. Add to that a very very wide torque span and you've got yourself a genuine supercar that's an absolutele joy to drive.

 

Regardless of which Esprit you choose, if you get a good one, and understand its limitations (no comparisons to 2015MY 911s...) you'll absolutely love it. The amount of positive attention and thumbs up you'll get from drivers and pedestrians around you wont cease to put a smile on your face. For some people just SEEING an Esprit in the flesh is enough to make their day. Owning one is even better.

 

If it's heart you're after, you've found your car.

 

Lastly a word of caution:

Esprits almost always look fantastic in pictures, and even with detailed, specific shots, it's still very very difficult to gauge the true condition of a car without seeing it in the flesh. Even then, it can be very hard to walk away after finding things that weren't quite up to snuff. If in doubt, walk away, walk the extra mile until you've found a car that's JUST right.

 

I understand some of the above might make the prospect of ownership seem daunting, but that's not my intention - if you get to choose, choose a car with the above things looked at. If you for whatever reason fall for one that isn't quite 100%, it's not the end of the world either. If you really like the Esprit, go for it - don't buy a Porsche because it seems "safer". There is no substitute for Esprit ownership.

 

Tip:

Scott Walker's - he has a yellow V8 from 1999 with absolutely impeccable service history. Scott also knows his stuff and I genuinely believe this car is worth looking into.

 

http://www.scottwalkers.co.uk/cars/car.php?id=168

 

The price listed on the site is not accurate. Give him a call if interested.

[Projectblue]

That reply just made my day - seriously, thank you. So often intro's get batted off with replies like 'search feature is your friend'. Lovely explanations and some very insightful points that I will take on board. I think it builds on my initial findings and feelings. Especially when it comes to what moves a person to open the garage door and go for a drive.  

 

If it helps, I also drive a Land Rover Defender, not an X5. Why? For all the reasons you list above. There are many parallels, not least the legendary British build quality *cough*. I felt that the Defender deserved the right car to go in the garage with it.

 

In terms of sourcing I am very much aware that its forum members who know of well known cars (both great and problematic) hence coming here (thanks for the pointer by the way) as I'd rather pay a little more and get a car that members all say "that one".

 

I've chatted with my local specialist SJ Sportscars to make sure I've got good back up too once I've found one.

 

 

 

*edited cos I missed two words out that made me look like a know it all - doh!

Edited August 16, 2014 by Projectblue

[cbclotus]

Hi Dave.Welcome if you fancy a look over my se turbo .No problem .You are welcome to pop over for a coffee. I am in half moon village.Mike.if the weather is ok I will take you for a spin....Mike

[Jacques]

Hi David,

Wellcome, and happy hunting! The search for a good Esprit can be short and happy or long and happy. I spent a few years, as there are not many lhd around my waters. Finally got one, that had a lot of love.. And still needs some But I am a happy man for it.

It is a true experience driving one, and I went to see some. As Vanya said, bring an icebox to keep your head cold, because they are indeed very seductive, those Esprits.

Personally I prefer a 4-pot, but the v8 surely have it's points too. Many parts are interchangable with some Work, if you are not a sucker for originality, otherwise it can be returned back easily. And prices on Esprit parts are surpringly low compared to many ordinary cars. Auch, shouldn't have said that

Are you going to work on your car yourself? If so, it's not as bad as I have been reading some places. If you are prepared to do it yourself, there's some serious money to save, as it's often time consuming work. But fun. And this site is a goldmine of info and helpfull knowledgeable people, and they will even travel to other countries, just to have a beer with you   Really great guys.

 

In my Humble view, the Esprit's are one of, if not nearly the most fun and involving a bit old school sports car to drive. Much more modern sports cars can do it better, no prob, but the fun and involvement is second to none in an Esprit. And it's a very capable car.

(get that, modern boring sports cars with their flappy pedals and shopping mode buttons).

 

Contrary to say Porsche or Ferrari, people will actually smile when they see a Lotus. Not that other peoples oppinnion matters, but it goes to show the sphere around the brand, AND the model.

 

When you find one, some happy day, please share with us what you have found  I even got so happy when I bought mine, and my wife likes it too, that I went out and bought a lot of new tools to celebrate it

 

In the end, if the car makes you turn around and look and smile once more, before you enter the house, it's the right one.

 

Here's a teaser of my own.

Cheers,

Jacques.

[Zolder]

 

If it helps, I also drive a Land Rover Defender, not an X5. Why? For all the reasons you list above. There are many parallels, not least the legendary British build quality *cough*. I felt that the Defender deserved the right car to go in the garage with it.

 

If you can live with a Defender, you can live with any Esprit!

 

Rich - 300Tdi 110 and S4s

[Projectblue]

Thanks for the replies.

 

Mike, that would be great - thanks for the offer, will take you up on it.

 

Jaques, thanks for the info - and that's a lovely car.

[rizla603104]

Totally agree with both replies above. If you appreciate the foibles of a defender  - then you'll certainly get the concept of the Esprit. For me it was an S4 that was my utopia. I have owned an S3, M100 and now own the factory purple one. If you're looking to find out more - come along to the Lotus Festival today at Brands and see them in the flesh. We're a candid bunch and can tell tell you the good things and bad things about ownership. Personally - my S4 makes me smile and ticks all boxes for me.

 

It gets used a few times a week (about 20-40 miles) and is loved greatly. V8's are great cars and can prove very reliable. When they do go wrong the bills can also be eye watering. But then I've had a few eye watering bills myself - I would recommend trying a V8 and S4s for comparison to feel the difference.

[Projectblue]

Cheers Rizla, looks like I'll miss today as Brands is a long way from here for a day out.

 

 

These are my principle reasons in car choice that led me to the Esprit in particular:

1) Driving - I love driving, the discipline of manual gearbox, threading a car through the bends etc. It's got to be quick, quicker than most things. That said, I generally drive like Miss Daisy and even when making ground, I'm not eeking out that last drop. You won't find me smoking tyres or thrashing engines. I am mechanically sympathetic. Thus a non bomb proof car is suitable.

2) Looks - I wanted something jaw droppingly different. If I'm spending £30k on a car it needs to be, as Jaques said, something you turn back to look at one last time before going inside. An M3, 911 or even Nissan GTR won't do it. Not special enough.

3) Different but part of something bigger - My M3 was a cracking car, but it would disappear in a line of traffic. I like being in a Defender an waving to other Defender owners. I like being part of a sub culture that 'gets it'. Besides, M3 owners by and large (small number excepted) are c***s.

4) More reliable and less chance of killing me than a TVR

 

I've looked over the photo's in the sticky thread and I'm confident I know how I want it to look, which colours I'd prefer. Now I've just got to find the right car. 

 

Happy to try S4 and V8 for comparison as suggested by Rizla as I may find the S4 is the car I should be buying. I'm in the Gatwick area early September so will stop by Scott Walker and have a look. Do they have a good reputation? (another reason why club forums are excellent - it's hard for somewhere to hide a bad reputation).

 

Thanks again for the info.

[espritmania]

Hi how far are you away from Exeter station??

[Projectblue]

15mins drive or 5min walk and 10min train ride

[Chillidoggy]

As a newcomer to the Lotus marque, I can say that this forum has been an invaluable source of information, and support. I would recommend investing in the full membership, you'll recoup the expense no problem.

Whilst searching for an S4s, I saw a lot of Esprits, and saw a lot of rubbish, quickly realising that all that glitters is not gold, but ultimately I plumped for one that looks nice, but is not without it's faults. Should I have bought it? Maybe not, but there you go. At the moment I kind of love it and hate it in equal measures.

But they just look so gorgeous, like a femme fatale, you can forgive them pretty much anything, even though you know it's going to cost you financially, emotionally, and physically. Just like a femme fatale.

Finally, be prepared to embrace alcoholism: it goes with the territory.

[Vanya]

Ian, can you imagine what owning two feels like?

 

I was having panic attacks almost daily until I collected the V8.....These have since disappeared however

 

Happy to try S4 and V8 for comparison as suggested by Rizla as I may find the S4 is the car I should be buying. I'm in the Gatwick area early September so will stop by Scott Walker and have a look. Do they have a good reputation? (another reason why club forums are excellent - it's hard for somewhere to hide a bad reputation).

 

Scott is wrapping up his current business and will be running it as a hobby in future, if I understood him right. He works at the Lotus factory so he commutes a lot. Give him a call and try to arrange a time for a viewing. I've heard nothing but good things about him from people on here and I got the impression that he knows his Loti when speaking to him on the phone.

 

I would have gotten that car if I hadn't found a V8 locally in Sweden, but it's been VERY well taken care of, owned by a celebrity musician, and has a bunch of extra from the factory which make it very special indeed (magnesium wheels and Sport 350 suspension for instance).

[Bibs]

Scott is wrapping up his business, he can't sell Lotuses and run the UK Territory for Lotus, it's too much of a conflict of interest akin to a copper having a burglary hobby! He's emptied the showroom, website will be closed soon and has also moved to Norfolk now. 

[rizla603104]

I've heard very positive things about Scott Walkers vehicles too I guess there could be some negotiation? Certainly try a few out - as there are good and bad ones out there and the bad ones can look good and vice versa. Get to know what is "normal" for an Esprit.

[espritmania]

I might be down that way with my S4,if I am I'll give you a shout.

[Projectblue]

Ok. Thanks

[Jacques]

That alcoholism you speak of Ian, must surely be the octane boost we pour in the gas tanks...

 

Cheers,

Jacques.

Hi Vanya,

WHAT???? you got a V8 extra?

 

And you haven't POSTED PICTURES?

 

Ehrmm....

 

Jacques.

[Vanya]

That alcoholism you speak of Ian, must surely be the octane boost we pour in the gas tanks...

 

Cheers,

Jacques.

Hi Vanya,

WHAT???? you got a V8 extra?

 

And you haven't POSTED PICTURES?

 

Ehrmm....

 

Jacques.

 

Hehe, well the weather in Sweden has been utter crap since I bought it and I'm not taking it out if there's the slightest chance of rain. Haven't even gotten around to washing it....

 

I'll post some nice shots taken with a respectable camera ASAP.

 

But in short, yep, I bought a V8. There's a few pics on my profile but they were taken with an iPhone. 

 

In the meantime I'm sticking to my Turbo SE the "all weather warrior". Can't say it feels like a compromise either. 

[Projectblue]

Anyone know Allon White Sports Cars? Listed a blue 2002 on Pistonheads? (can't make the link work).

Ta

[Bibs]

Allon White used to be a main dealer and are now a Lotus approved repairer. Good bunch as far as I know

[pete]

this the one

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/lotus/esprit/lotus-esprit-v8-turbo-25th-anniversary-model/2731792

[NeilP]

Have a look here

http://www.allonwhite.co.uk/Used-Lotus-Cars-For-Sale/

[Projectblue]

this the one

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/lotus/esprit/lotus-esprit-v8-turbo-25th-anniversary-model/2731792

Yep, that's the one thank you :-)

[hedgerley]

I've dealt with Allon White, albeit for my Esprit seat re-furb. not a car sale/purchase. Very pleasant to deal with and they did an outstanding job. MMC in Edinburgh rate them highly.