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Euro question - 23rd June


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I thought it was Starmer who was head of the DPP when they investigated the failings over the many years that this had happened - and found that the CPS were at fault.

I also believe he was the one who said that people who know about such matters - but fail to raise them - should also be held to account. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/nov/04/child-abuse-keir-starmer-prosecute-professionals

Indeed - Paul Gambaccini has issues with Starmer because of the investigations made, following false allegation, carried out when Starmer was head of the CPS - so it seems you're dammed if you do; dammed if you don't - and I guess hindsight is a wonderful thing. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8211355/BBC-DJ-demands-Keir-Starmer-apologise-role-historic-sex-abuse-scandal.html

In any event - the failure to investigate properly went over many years - with various different Governments and DPP's in place. 

 

 

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@JG220 @andydclements @scotty435 and other remainers Chaps I really enjoy our discussions here and want to thank you for your input. I think healthy debate is really good and helps us all. I

A 2nd vote would be the thing that would get me on to the streets.   There is a large silent  mass of people who regularly hand over our decisions to government  via the democratic process.  We accept

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2018/10/tony-abbott-how-to-save-brexit/  

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Cyprus has rejected the Canada/EU trade agreement over halloumi.

https://cyprus-mail.com/2020/08/04/talks-to-begin-with-parties-after-rejection-of-ceta/

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Speaking on condition of anonymity, sources close to the government told the Cyprus Mail they will begin talks with the parties who voted against the ratifying bill, in a bid to “better explain to them” the treaty.

So they need to vote again as they didn't understand what they were voting against - that sounds familiar - although "Last Friday, parliament voted by 37 against and 18 for the treaty; there were no abstentions." is a lot bigger majority than 52/48.

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Cheesegate!

I believe the ones who voted against are in for a right good grilling and if they can't agree, a few will be toasted.

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I blame Claude Palpatine.

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British Fart to Florida, Nude to New York, Dunce to Denmark, Numpty to Newfoundland.  And Shitfaced Silly Sod to Sweden.

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Watching the news over the past 24 hours it seems that we are under a small invasion of immigrants illegally entering the country on boats from France. I'm struggling to understand (I know, I'm thick) a couple of things

1. Under EU law aren't illegal immigrants supposed to declare themselves and claim asylum at their point of entry into the EU?

2. If so, why are they "allowed" to travel across the EU to get to France and why are the French not locking them all up and returning them to whence they came if they have no right to assylum?

3. Why are the French insisting that the UK needs to pay for their inability to not deal with the problem and why don't we just send them straight back as soon as they have landed?  I do not see why the UK should be paying France to do what the EU laws say they should be doing in the first place.

What am I missing here? Please educate me.

Thanks

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I’m unsure why they are not being intercepted - towed back and boats destroyed. Works just fine for the Australians.

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1. Yes

2. They don't want them

3. Why not? We'll more than likely give them the money too. 

Once they're in UK waters, some UN resolution means that we have to save them. They turn off their engines off the coast so we're duty bound to rescue them. Once they're here, they all say they are 15 with no ID to confirm and as children we have a duty of care. 

Australia has a harder line and it would be nice if we weren't such a soft touch, there's talk of the UK adopting some of their policies with the recent influx. Genuine asylum seekers are very welcome, economic ones not so much. 

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Easy solved - just give them more benefits in Scotland as part of the Barnet formula - send them all up there. Once Scotland gets its independence and rejoins the EU we can build a fence 😂

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Its  a messed  up system nobody wants to deal with.      Being in Kent we see it a bit more in the local news than the rest of the Uk and this has been going on with the boats for 2 years.    The cost is huge for the tax payer ( although nothing compared to covid).    If they stand any chance of looking under 16 they all go for it as its regarded as the premium deal, they get foster care ( costs the state £1k a week with an independent fosteriing agency) and school.  If over 16 its shared house in comunity and collage.     Ive seen the over 16 route and im not suprised they want the foster care route however they get the same housing a UK kid gets if they went independent at 16..     

They have  different ideas  to the way we live here and have been sold a package deal by the smugglers and are VERY unhappy when they realise it not what they were told they would get ie house, car job as a doctor, go to cambridge or oxford yes the crap I have heard you would not beleive.      We have fostered 4 and now refuse to  look after any more.  

Most come from well adjusted familys with good backgrounds and probabaly quite wealthy as the journey cost is 4-5 years average wages, their problems really start on the journey over here.         

One of the lads we looked after had this year booked a plane trip ( cancelled due to covid) back to the neighbouring country to his home  to go back home and see his family so it does make a mockery of the whole asylum case.    This stuff is all well known by UK authoritys but nobody can be bothered to do anything about it.  

 

From his story one had seen  murder at arms length in the last 5 months and most had seen rape and assault and killings  up very close on their journeys over here ( that I do think is true) and within 3  days off arriving popped straight into a local secondary school with your  11 year old son or daughter, used to really anoy me when the SW would then rattle on about safeguarding etc.    

We now look after only  UK kids,   much much more damaged but the  satisfaction in playing a small part in turing their life about is huge.   Plus I never have to have a 20 year old in my face again shouting  "IT MY RIGHT".    We had a very intense  nose to nose conversation on that one.    

 We should have a lottery system for those countrys  with a refugee right.     If your  number comes up old or  young, straight or gay, healthy or unhealthy, male or female we fly you over from source avoiding the smugglers. EVERYBODY else straight back home the moment they land on the beach otherwise this will never stop.

 

Just remembered when the first 2 came to us it was when the ebola thing ws going on and when they arrived in Italy and France all the authoritys did was checked their temperature give them a train pass and show them the trains towards the UK.   Neither they or the French or Italians wanted  finger printing as that ties them to France and Italy.    It really is our own fault for having such a slack boarder policing system.    The first lad was in a dairy  lorry with 24 others that didnt get spotted till in UK.

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This is what I find annoying about the immigration system.

Person in commonwealth country is sent to the UK for a course by their employer, say for 2 weeks in February. Applies for visa, and instead of receiving a single entry visa for the period of their stay, they get given a 6 month multiple entry visa. They come over here and attend their course and return to their country of origin - and the employer is off the hook. They now have 5 1/2 months in which they can come back into the UK and disappear or claim asylum.

I know of one person who did this. Took about 5-6 years to get the asylum granted. Within two weeks, back on a plane for a holiday in the country they claimed asylum from. I think his wife has followed the same process. 

My sister in law on the other hand went to Germany on a course (she is a German teacher in a Commonwealth country). We invited her to come and visit the UK for two weeks after her course, so requested that she a) gets her return ticket changed, and also her visa changed to allow her to visit the UK and then fly back on her German Embassy funded ticket. The Germans issue a single entry visa for the duration of the stay. SIL said all done, so we issued the invite, she got her 6 month visa for her two week stay and booked her return air ticket to Hamburg to coincide with her return flight to Africa.

All well and good until we return to Heathrow to fly her back to Hamburg. Her German visa had been extended, but not changed to multiple entry, so they wouldn't let her check in. FCUK was my response. She came home with us and was on the Emirates flight via Dubai the next day. Next time she came on a course, we flew out to visit her in Germany.

Why is it impossible for the UK immigration to issue a single entry visa for the duration. Before the day of scanning the passport, they also had no idea if someone had left the country or even when they arrived.

 

 

 

 

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As a known Brexiteir people often assume Im anti immigration but its never really been a thing thats that high on my priory.

Recently though I find myself wondering WTF is going on?

The amount of people landing on our beaches is crazy. I just dont understand why our Navy isnt there just sending them back to France?

Seems we seem to have tried to reason with Europe and the French but this has not worked.

We have one of the best Navy's in the world so why cant we protect our borders from these amateurs? 

The amateur photographers getting themselves arrested for filming this should be pardoned and thanked.

Why does it take the likes of Nigel Farrage to have to make films to expose what is going on?

What we need is a decent drone company ideally based in Kent to get some footage over the course of a day  :thumbup: The press coverage would either make or break them though.

 

buddsy

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"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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As I understand it, prior to the Immigration acts of the 1960s ALL Commonwealth citizens had the right to travel to the UK visa free, work settle down etc.. People would come and go as they liked and there was no need to "claim asylum" - like my previous example. However during the 1960s a number of acts were passed in parliament to restrict the rights of Commonwealth citizens to this free entry. 

  • Commonwealth Immigrants Act 1962
  • Commonwealth Immigrants Act 1968
  • Immigration Act 1971

The last one was the nail in the coffin as it gave European Community citizens priority over non EC citizens (i.e. Commonwealth). So eventually leading to the current situation where a Commonwealth citizen(*) has to fight to get a visa to come here, and then once here claim asylum to be able to stay. 

(*) although Australian, New Zealand, Canada and some South Africans don't necessarily have to fight so hard - see below. 

There was a scheme called the Working Holiday Visa  - (now morphed into the Youth Mobility Scheme visa). This was available to ALL Commonwealth citizens under the age of 26( I think), and allowed successful applicants to come to the UK to work for 6 months, travel for 6 months, work 6 months and travel 6 months before going home. I knew about this before I moved to Africa as I had employed a couple of Zimbabweans how were in the UK under this scheme (although they worked solidly for the whole two years before returning to Zimbabwe).

When I was in Uganda I had cause to visit the British High Commission a number of times to obtain visas for people to travel to the UK. During the time I was in country it became more and more difficult for Ugandans' to obtain visas to the UK, and when I raised the question of the Working Holiday visa. I detected some panic in the chap I was talking to and was basically told not to mention this scheme to Ugandans. On investigating further there had been ONE successful applicant from Uganda in the previous 5 or so years, whereas the countries named above had numbers in the hundreds, if not thousands.

The current scheme is now restricted to

  • Australia - 31,000 visas
  • Canada - 6,000 visas
  • Hong Kong - 1,000 visas
  • Japan - 1,000 visas
  • Monaco - 1,000 visas
  • New Zealand - 14,000 visas
  • South Korea - 1,000 visas
  • Taiwan - 1,000 visas

This was changed in 2008 from the one I knew about (and I thought was still in operation).

 

Edit to add: This has awoken my interest and I've sent a FOI request for the figures for all countries for the 5 years before and after the scheme was changed. See if my memory was correct.

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Look forward to seeing a no-deal working without affecting trade.

For my own business I put into place PLT (paperless trade) ages ago so we can send worldwide with no accompanying paperwork at all. Works beautifully.

For Brexit all I have to do is change one setting to enable PLT for EU countries, which will take 1 minute. I have no idea why some people are going on about endless queues of trucks to the ports. I might be wrong as some of the people complaining about this are haulage companies but we will see.

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Check out her last sentence - "We also acknowledge that the UK would like to have a certain amount of independence"

I'm sorry, but if that is the correct translation, this is a complete lack of understanding of the UK.

 

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She needs to just admit the fourth reich has fallen 

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