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Euro question - 23rd June

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48 minutes ago, Buddsy said:

The Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011 (c. 14) is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom that received Royal Assent on 15 September 2011, introducing fixed-term elections to the Westminster parliament for the first time. Under the provisions of the Act, parliamentary general elections must be held every five years, beginning in 2015.

 

So when is the next Scottish Independence election?

If they vote exit will they be able to vote back in the next one 5 years later.

If the Brexit referendum was the same as an election you'll have your chance again in 5 years time.

Everyone knew what the referendum was for and voted accordingly. 

 

buddsy

In the UK we still have the option or early elections, called by parliament (or by parliament having failed to decide whether they should), so even though it's called the "fixed term" it's not fixed, it just sets out the conditions for calling an election such as a vote of no confidence.

 

A general election takes effect immediately, and the end result is known (it will be one of the candidates on the ballot), but the referendum hasn't actually resulted in us leaving yet, so a second vote still has purpose.

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29 minutes ago, andydclements said:

but the referendum hasn't actually resulted in us leaving yet, so a second vote still has purpose.

Not left yet but article 50 was triggered we started the process of leaving.

Maybe I have the wrong idea but thats how I thought a democratic repulic worked?

 

Actually I now think if there were to be another vote even more people would vote to leave ...if for no reason othere than to pee off Gina Miller & Amber Rudd.

 

buddsy

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"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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Well, if it's democracy, then there can be no blocking a call for a vote, although we still have a monarchy so aren't a republic.

I think if there was another vote, then at least people would be able to vote based on what the deal is not what the bunch of ignorant a*holes (Farage, BoJo etc) said we would get (access to free market, no immigration, not subject to EU rules etc), and based on how we're viewed by our allies in EU. It would be a referendum based on fact not fantasy.

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29 minutes ago, andydclements said:

It would be a referendum based on fact not fantasy.

Those of us who voted to leave know exactly what we voted for. It was crystal clear, leave means leave, simple as that. FACT

The only fantasy here is expecting to get any type of pre exit deal that will be of any benefit to anyone other than the EU. 

2.5 years of wasted time and huge amounts of our money to find out what was blatantly obvious. FANTASY

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1 hour ago, andydclements said:

at least people would be able to vote based on what the deal is not what the bunch of ignorant a*holes (Farage, BoJo etc) 

Thats fine but how are you going to stop the EU funded fear machine that is the BBC using their dominant position unfairly influence people who listen to them?

Example: I saw a BBC news item where they were at the port of Harwich saying at the moment 1/3 of the good entering where from the EU and need no customs checks but after a Brexit they would need to be checked...but that means 2/3 (i.e. the majority) of the goods do need to be checked and are being checked with no problems. Even the boss of the port Dover said the extra checks would not be an issue.

 

buddsy


 

"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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11 hours ago, andydclements said:

Well, if it's democracy, then there can be no blocking a call for a vote, although we still have a monarchy so aren't a republic.

Parliament blocked a referendum for years when all the opinion polls showed we wanted one, Cameron only allowed it because of the rise of UKIP taking all his voters & the likes of Labour would still be blocking it because they know we wanted out.


Cheers,

John W

http://jonwatkins.co.uk

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I reckon if you asked the question :-

 

should we remain in the EU?

or all drop dead immediately?

 

that would possibly be more balanced.

 

we have had a referendum and a result. This silly “deal” was never on the ballot paper - and won’t get parliamentary backing. So it’s all a bit of a nonsense really


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Saw this today - sums it up well

 

"Before we joined the EU, we used to have a system whereby only an elected Parliament in this country could make the laws. After the signing of the Maastricht Treaty and subsequent ones, this has disappeared and we now have an unelected European Commission proposing laws to the European Parliament (which our MEPs can be outvoted on by MEPs who represent constituents in other countries). My questions are as follows:

1) Why do you like the new system?

2) Where's the democracy?

3) What's wrong with going back to the old system, like we Brexiteers want to do?

The other point I wanted to mention is trade. Let's have a look at the facts:

1) The UK is the EU's second largest export market.

2) The UK is the number one destination for exports of German cars.

3) The UK is one of the largest economies in the world.

4) The UK is a member of dozens of international organisations.

My questions to the Remainers about these are as follows:

1) Why do you think the UK will be "isolated" once we leave the EU, given the above points?

2) Why do you think one of the largest economies in the world is suddenly going to face a trade embargo or massive trade restrictions when these things go against WTO rules?

3) Why do you think one of the largest economies in the world is unable to cope outside a political union?

I have one final question for the Remainers:

When are you going to accept the referendum result and join the Brexiteers in campaigning for a bright future for the UK outside the EU?


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23 hours ago, andydclements said:

A general election takes effect immediately, and the end result is known (it will be one of the candidates on the ballot), but the referendum hasn't actually resulted in us leaving yet, so a second vote still has purpose.

Also, if you want to pick up people get your own facts straight too please. We do not, in the UK vote for a Prime Minister in a general election (as you pointed out earlier the UK is not a republic). We actually vote for a Party to lead and it is the name of the Parties, not the candidates, that appear on the ballot papers is it not? Usually, the leader of said party then accepts the post of Prime Minister and forms a government.  At no time has the "name" of the candidate been used at a General Election to select the Prime Minister. That is why when May was being shouted down bu the narcissist Sturgeon and others for not been "voted in" all they were doing was showing their own ignorance. It is the leader at the time, of the party voted in to power, who becomes the Prime Minister and if May had merely pointed this out then we would not have had that bloody stupid and disastrous snap election in the first place.


Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!        

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8 hours ago, JG220 said:

Sample size of 5043????!

Well thats conclusive.

I think many people think YouGov is some kind of government agency but its just an internet based market research company.

 

buddsy


 

"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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I could go to Hull and Boston and Grantham tomorrow and do a poll of 10,000 people and around 7000 of them would be asking why we are not out yet. Representative samples are not worth the effort of doing them, as several of our recent elections and votes have proven well. More obfuscation. (if you have not noticed this is my word of the week and I award myself a wee dram every time I get to use it). 

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Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!        

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1 hour ago, C8RKH said:

I award myself a wee dram every time I get to use it. 

Can you still stand up :wine:

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2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

I actually totally disagree with your logic here, in fact, you are not using logic!

We had a democratic vote and the result was clear - leave. So until the result of that vote is honoured, then, democracy has not been served and the will, at the time of the vote, of the people, has not been prosecuted. Ergo, no democracy.

Now, after the will of the people has been prosecuted, and the result of the democratic vote has been executed, there is no reason at all for calls not to be made for a new, fresh vote, on whether we should rejoin the EU or stay independent of it.

So no amount of smart ass comments trying to say that without another vote it is not democratic please. Undermining the result of the first vote is not, however you want to tart it up or paint up, democracy in action.

Also, at no point for the first vote, was there any discussion about terms or deals being a pre-consideration. It was a simple question, should we stay in or leave. End of. Everything else is just being used to confuse, obfuscate and delay the process of prosecuting what was the democratic decision of the people at the time of the vote.

So can we stop the bull shit and just get on with it?

Democratic process has the option for opinions to be re-polled, just in the same way that we review the decision of which person will represent us as the MP/Councillor/MEP etc. So, there is the logic that i did use, so you are in fact completely incorrect there (as it's your uninformed view as to what thought process I'd gone through). So feel free to apologies for a lie.

2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

Also, if you want to pick up people get your own facts straight too please. We do not, in the UK vote for a Prime Minister in a general election (as you pointed out earlier the UK is not a republic). We actually vote for a Party to lead and it is the name of the Parties, not the candidates, that appear on the ballot papers is it not? Usually, the leader of said party then accepts the post of Prime Minister and forms a government.  At no time has the "name" of the candidate been used at a General Election to select the Prime Minister. That is why when May was being shouted down bu the narcissist Sturgeon and others for not been "voted in" all they were doing was showing their own ignorance. It is the leader at the time, of the party voted in to power, who becomes the Prime Minister and if May had merely pointed this out then we would not have had that bloody stupid and disastrous snap election in the first place.

Perhaps you'd care to re-read my post. I stated that it's a vote for a candidate, I at no point mentioned PM. In fact, that was a reply to  a discussion where I specified that it was the representative in parliament, so it's clear that i meant the MP. 

No, you don't vote for the party, if it was for the party, then in the event of the candidate having to resign (or death etc)  then the party would appoint a new MP.  It's for a specific candidate.

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They have the audacity to re-poll this decision and you can expect widespread and very serious public disorder.  

We are less than a decade or two away from a United States or Europe with a common armed forces and no control of our own country. There’s a whole lot of folks whom aren’t utterly blinkered and can see this coming. I’m not sure I’d say civil war - but it’ll get very close


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12 hours ago, JG220 said:

Well it seems to be, even on one of the most brexit forums there are some of us trying to look at reason, let the tide come in, second vote it is 💪

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Its all just like Steve Bannon said.I know its a repost from a week ago but just listen to what he says"they have no intention of letting you leave"

So I ask again are we at war? Are we at war but dont realise it?

 

buddsy

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"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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On 21/12/2018 at 10:58, JG220 said:

 

"Vote Remain in the EU" Facebook page poll

 

Remain.jpg

 

 

buddsy

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"Belief is the enemy of knowing" - Crrow777

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