Where'd the weight in the Evora come from?

[JayEmm]

Hi all,

Continuing to do my Evora research. One thing with the Evora that confuses me is "where" the weight in the car comes from. As I understand it, the car is an aluminium bonded tub, with a fibreglass (or carbon) body on top. No traditional steel frames etc etc...

They're also not very luxuriously appointed cars, so I am curious where the weight in them is. An Evora 410 is 1325KG, but that's missing air con, radio, etc... the 400 has been lightened significantly from the "S" it replaces but still weighs in at nearly 1400KG. These I assume are "DIN" weights too, not EC weights with half a tank of fuel and a 75KG driver.

Okay, granted - they're lighter than a lot of their contemporaries - the R8 V8 was 1560Kg but very luxurious and packing a V8 - the Aston V8 is a similar weight but also has a V8 & Luxury interior - an E46 M3 is some 1500Kg (The CSL being 110KG lighter) - the big Jags are fairly porky.

A Cayman GT4 is only a few KGs heavier than an Evora 410, and as far as I can tell it has a lot more metal in it... so I am just curious really, where is the weight in the Evora coming from? Is the V6 a fairly heavy motor? I am guessing maybe that's a bit of a lump given the fact it isn't really designed as a "motorsport" unit...

[Bibs]

29 minutes ago, JayEmm said:

They're also not very luxuriously appointed cars

While it's not Rolls-Royce, I think the Evora is pretty well appointed inside. It may not have a miriad of buttons and cup holders but most people who have seen the Evora's I've had are really impressed with the interior quality. Wait 'til you see the interior of a Series 1 Elise! 

[JayEmm]

Oh I've recently seen an S1 elise, as well as the current Lotus line-up. Honestly, the quality of the new cars shocked me - in a good way. Really, really well finished I thought. Far better than many Ferraris and Porsches of not-too-long ago.

However, they don't have zillion way electric massaging seats, sunroofs, spare wheels, masses of boot space, a V8, or in the case of the standard 410.... sun visors!

I have read that the Evora is a much stiffer chassis than the Elise, however does anyone know the weight of an Evora chassis vs an Elise? Or is that top-secret information?

[Bibs]

Evora chassis - 203kg

Elise chassis - 68kg

 

[JayEmm]

Wow, that's amazing. I haven't seen pictures of the two compared but I guess they share basically nothing beyond production method and a badge.

 

That's nearly 150Kg accounted for, given the fact the elise is 4-pot only, and the Evora is a supercharged V6, I bet there's a fair chunk of weight there too. The old non-supercharged car was what, 40-50kg lighter?

[Bibs]

The 2GR-FE is 163kgs, a K-Series is 96kg.

[TBD]

At least in the Evora and Evora S quite a bit of weight is going into sound deadening. Also not to be forgotten, the +2 rear seats.

[JAWS]

30 minutes ago, Bibs said:

Evora chassis - 203kg

Elise chassis - 68kg

 

That's not a fair comparison as the Evora fig you've quoted includes front and rear subframes. The Elise number being just the tub. Tub to tub, there's from memory ~10kgs in it

[Bibs]

Elise FTW

 

[JayEmm]

10 minutes ago, TBD said:

At least in the Evora and Evora S quite a bit of weight is going into sound deadening. Also not to be forgotten, the +2 rear seats.

Those "rear seats" are basically cushions though, I doubt there's any inherent weight. Frankly I'd rather Lotus have used it for a longitudinal engine, or bigger traditional boot, but that's me.

So is the Evora chassis basically an "extended" Elise/Exige tub, or a  ground-up new item?

[JAWS]

To do the same journey as the Evora you'd need 2 x Elises to carry the same number of people which would weigh more! Evora FTW

[JayEmm]

Frankly I think the whole 2+2 thing is man maths.... I just can't see anyone who would be buying a 75K car new that doesn't have something else, or live with someone else who has a car with four regular seats.

In the 911 it's more or less a function of how they designed the car, but in the Evora I'm not quite sure what the logic was. Maybe it was them trying to go after the 911...

I don't have kids, so I just see the back seats as an annoying luggage area

[JAWS]

13 minutes ago, JayEmm said:

So is the Evora chassis basically an "extended" Elise/Exige tub, or a  ground-up new item?

Bit of both.

Evora chassis plus front and rear subframes...

Elise chassis plus rear subframe, it then has a composite crash structure bonded to the front...

[JayEmm]

Interesting. I gather that there is a big advantage to having front/rear subframes in that in the event of a front/rear end collision the subframe should take some of the brunt of the impact rather that it going directly into the main tub?

[Bibs]

That. Then you just swap it.

Fact of the day. When type approving the car, there's a crash test where a large lump of concrete hits the rear of the stationary car at 30mph and to pass the engine cannot intrude into the passenger cell. The Evora not only (obviously) passed this test but was, I believe for the first time ever, in good enough repair once a new rear subframe/clam etc were fitted, that it could be used for more crash testing. Usually the cars are such a mess they head straight off to the crusher.

[Gm77]

33 minutes ago, JayEmm said:

Frankly I think the whole 2+2 thing is man maths.... I just can't see anyone who would be buying a 75K car new that doesn't have something else

Absolutely. We have an Elise as our practical car.

[superdavelotus]

So what does the NA weigh without fuel? I see in my books it says 1382KG with full tank of fuel which is 60 litres.

I just checked and it looks like the fuel equates to 45KG which makes the NA 1337KG.

It would be interesting to see what needs to be done to get the NA down to 1300KG.

[Danelaw]

There are more radiators and more oil and water in the Evora too. Given the weight of more expensive/exotic cars like the F458 is comparable or heavier wet, then Lotus have not done too bad a job.

[TheKevlarKid]

Rear engine cover with glass = heavy

Rear Clam = heavy

Front clam and nose peice = heavy

Seats = heavy

Exhaust back box = heavy

Wiring looms = heavy

Std brake discs = heavy

Doors with side glass and all gubbins = heavy

 

 

[JayEmm]

It certainly doesn't help that many manufacturers use different weight standards. The italians in particular are notorious for quoting dry weights.

I do find it laughable when you see an Aston Martin press release saying "lightweight" this, "Carbon Fibre" that, "aluminium" the other... then somehow the car still weighs 1800kg

[Advantage]

Goes to show how much of a millstone the Elise is for Evora sales. Perception is that the Evora is somehow a scaled up two seater weekend go kart - even to those who have an interest in the marque.

[JayEmm]

24 minutes ago, Advantage said:

Goes to show how much of a millstone the Elise is for Evora sales. Perception is that the Evora is somehow a scaled up two seater weekend go kart - even to those who have an interest in the marque.

That isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I suppose the only problem with being years ahead of other manufacturers when it comes to production techniques is that it can come across as "Laziness" when in fact you were just waiting for the others to play catch-up.

As far as I know the Aston Martin "VH" architecture is closely related to that used by Lotus to build their cars

[Advantage]

The Aston VH chassis was developed by the boys and girls at Hethel. But the good folk at Gaydon slather on an awful lot of sound deadening and insulation, not to mention the more substantial composite panels, all of which add weight but give the car a more solid feel. The Evora has gone down a similar route to get it away from the toy-car comparisons of the Elise. 

[JayEmm]

Are there any metal panels on an Evora? I don't think that there are...

I believe some of the TVR "T" cars were allegedly around the 1100kg mark, however they were built using substantially different methods and I am sure are probably very bad in the all-important torsional rigidity tests

A quick check of wikipedia (A source that never lies) tells me a Ferrari 458 Italia is 1485KG "Kerb" weight, I presume that to be DIN/no passenger. It's actually 35kg heavier than the F430, which surprised me. 

A Ferrari Enzo is apparently 1255Kg - an incredible figure, as if you've ever seen one in the flesh you'll know they are vast

[the83man]

A Mk2 Cortina Lotus is 930KG..............