Non chargecooled system upgrades worth it in a tropical country?

[Xisthos]

I live in the Philippines where we always have high humidity, and the average temps are about 27deg all year around. I'm looking at upgrading the power of my Sport 350 and I'm looking at three possible options:

1) Komo Tec 430 - relatively simple upgrades, but considering the weather, I might not feel the power as much

2) Komo Tec 460 - would definitely make a lot more sense..BUT requires a lot more work and any shop I'll bring the components to would never have worked on upgrades on any Lotus before. I'm confident though that it can be done as we do have our fair share of exotics here but I'm getting the impression that it's a fair amount of work, aside from the fact that more parts can break down (like the electric pump). 

3) SSC TVS1900 - Looks like a fair bit of work that has to be done as well but I reckon I'd benefit from increasing the size of the blower more. The visibility isn't a big deal to me. What scares me more is that I've seen people complain that their aftersales service leaves much to be desired. 

Obviously the simplest route is the first but I'm unsure whether the actual power generated in my conditions would be worth my time. Cost is not so much a factor as the Exige here is GBP120k, so the upgrades are relatively "cheap" in comparison to the car.  What do you guys think?

[alias23]

Given your location and as you say the temps and humidity i'd hazard a guess to say that the Komotec kit would not best unless you went the 460 route which comes with the charge cooler. At least this way you've got something trying to help keep the temps down. It is a big install I'm led to believe, but I hear about 20 installs have already occurred and the Komotec kits do seem to be high quality and well built. 

Im glad to see you add the SSC upgrade as an alternative option to the Komotec kits. Im keen to hear peoples opinions on the differences and which they think would best perform in different conditions and use cases for how the Exige is used ie. Track vs Road etc... Also keen to hear if anyone has a view on why Komotec just didnt add a bigger charger like SSC has in the the first instance...

Anyhow, from my very limited research into the SSC kit, the install seems to be a lot easier than the Komotec kits. For one, you don't need to replace the manifolds, the only slight challenge is the change of pulley, cutting into one of the plastic covers, and replacement of belt which can be a little tricky and tight.

So I would suspect the SSC install would be done in a day vs 3 to more days with the Komotec. Note, SSC are marketing the kits as the only kit available that doesn't create a 'heat' problem, but they still create heat just maybe not as high or as quickly as the Komotec 430 kit, but it still creates heat.

I think one of two people on launch of the first SSC kits had problems, and there where a few people who had problems with the speed of customer service, however i'm led to believe the kits have been further tweaked and now are largely plug and play and well tested by a good few owners over in Oz. Personally, i've dealt with SSC a few times and found them to be quite responsive. I had purchased a set of upgraded gear and cross gate cables which arrived both fast, and with good instructions, I did have a few teething issues which they responded back to me upon within 24 hours and all was resolved. I even got a mail a few weeks later checking all was okay and my 'teething' issue had been resolved etc.. So i've only had good experiences, however gear cables vs charger upgrade are different things and have very different complexities so I can understand your concern.

On this note, this best thing you can do is test both companies, ask them questions and see how quick they respond. Ask the difficult ones such as whats the  biggest problem or 'gotcha' when installing your kit etc. etc..

Good luck and please let us know what insights you find and ultimately which kit you decide to install

 

[Xisthos]

Thanks Imran. It would have been nice to have such a simple install such as the one of the 430 but the heat is a major issue here. I'm going to try what you said and email them straight, that way I get a feel of both companies. If anyone who has use the SSC kit here could chime in on how the newer versions are, that would be great 

[alias23]

Please let us know how you get on!

[Aussie]

Hi, I am in Australia and have fitted the SSC TVS1900 Kit.  An awesome upgrade.  Did all the work myself, took about a day.  Not difficult but parts of it a bit fiddly due to limited space.  You do not have to cut the bodywork under the engine lid - the Pulley goes close to the body but doesn't touch it and never has since I've had the upgrade.  The most fiddly part of the install is threading on the new Supercharger/Engine drive belt - there is not a lot of room between the side of the engine and the chassis and there is an aluminium cover on part of the side of the engine that has to be undone and the belt threaded behind.

Awesome increase in Torque & Power and no heat soak issues due to the higher volumetric efficiency of the TVS1900.

Read here for details (make sure you read the "SSC's opinion" Tab at the bottom of the page: http://www.simplysportscars.com/shop/home/10528-sscv6exigetvs1900superchargerupgrade

The installation instructions are also available there as a pdf.

Edited August 7, 2016 by Aussie

[French Frie]

thanks for your feedback, Mark ... great to know it can be done at home ! did you by any chance dynoed your car ? we're still hoping for an independent dyno test on this SSC's upgrade (as well as for the EX430 upgrade) to have a fair comparison point. Do you know if it was already installed on a IPS car ? 

once again, unless the contrary can be proved, I do assume a bigger supercharger is the wiser option ... and maybe the stock SC/manifold combo can be sold to an Evora NA owner (or toyota owner) who wants to upgrade  ? 

[alias23]

I'd really like to hear from someone whose upgraded to the SSC kit, gone to track and absolutely nailed it all day, then come back and confirm - Heat soak issues or not.... Plus of course the independent dyno as @French Frie mentioned. 

[Aussie]

I haven't been to get the car Dyno'd yet but it is on my "To Do" list.  As I'm sure you've all experienced, different Dyno's produce different results, so it's very hard to compare "Apples with Apples".  What I can say though is that I've had it on the Track for 2 Track Days and during both those, I never felt the car was any weaker at the end of each session from when I started.  It just kept "pulling like a freight train" all the way through.  Sessions were up to 30 min at a time.  Also note that Australia is a hot country, so our ambient Track temps are going to typically be higher than Europe & the UK.

As I understand it, the philosophy is that because the TVS1900 pushes through 1.5 times the volume of Air when compared to the factory TVS1320, that you can run it at lower boost pressures, therefore introducing a lot less heat into the pressurised air, therefore meaning that the density is higher than it would be if it were hotter.  I am also under the impression that the factory TVS1320 is already spinning close to it's maximum RPM.

I have no reason to doubt SSC's published figures - if you read the information on their website, you'll see that they have taken a conservative view in quoting likely Engine output levels.

They have also developed a Water to Air Charge Cooler to sit as a Sandwich between the Engine and the Supercharger - in their race car that they run over here in a National series, they mate that to the TVS1900 but the issue with that for our road cars is that the entire assembly sits quite high and will not fit underneath the glass boot lid.  There is one guy over here running the Charge Cooler with the standard TVS1320 in a road car (because that fits under the engine lid) but I understand that the TVS1900 without charge cooler still produces substantially more Power & Torque than the charge cooled TVS1320.  The TVS1900 install is also far less complicated because you aren't installing front mounted Radiator/Heat exchangers.

Note that if you are going to sell off your TVS1320, you retain the manifold on the Exige - the Footprint for the TVS1900 is identical so mates to it the same way.  (Remember that both the TVS1320 & TVS1900 are made here in Australia by Harrop Engineering).

[alias23]

I guess that it is a major benefit of the SSC it's easily reversible and can arguably be resold on ...

[Fortis]

Good point Imran.

I would probably go down the route of fitting the SSC TVS 1900 at some point in the future when the warranty runs out . 

[Aussie]

Guys, in case you are not aware, I have a thread on this over on the playground.  There's a few pictures there aswell.

http://forums.the playground.org/viewthread.php?tid=412496&page=3

Ofcourse you'll know to replace #the playground# with the 5 letter name of the other forum starting with an "S" and ending with a "c" !

Edited August 11, 2016 by Aussie

[French Frie]

thanks Mark for the info ... would you be kind enough to take pictures from your car, with the SC viewed from the cockpit (like seen in the rear mirror), and through the rear glass (from outside) ? and one more showing the pulley to the clamshell clearance would be great ! thanks ...

[Aussie]

Hi there, no problem - I will do that for you tomorrow (It's night time here now in Australia, so a bit dark for photos).

[Aussie]

In the meantime, here a couple of existing Photos:

Original TVS1320 Pulley Gap, then closeup of the TVS1900 Gap, then a Full Engine Bay picture

 

[Hangar 111]

On 10/08/2016 at 18:22, alias23 said:

I'd really like to hear from someone whose upgraded to the SSC kit, gone to track and absolutely nailed it all day, then come back and confirm - Heat soak issues or not.... Plus of course the independent dyno as @French Frie mentioned. 

Imran, if you get one, I will heat soak it on our dyno next to an EX460, then we will know! 

Dave

[French Frie]

thanks Mark for the pics ... the pulley is really near from the  bodyshell, now ! it doesn't touch, even when the engine is rocking fore and aft ?? I noticed that the air intake is now pointing to the front of the car now... no problem to connect it to the filter  and pointing the HKS filter to the scoop  ? 

by looking at the Jubu website, I assume they're using a new injection ramp, as well as new (upgraded I suppose) injectors, whereas IIRC SSC re-use the original ones ... did anybody with this kit has fitted an AFR gauge to check the engine is not running lean ? 

[Aussie]

Yes the Pulley is quite near to the body shell - I would estimate about 5 - 7 mm away from it.  Since I have had it in, it has never touched the body shell.  I have seen some people cut away the edge of the body shell with different upgrades but really with this TVS1900 upgrade, it is not necessary.  If you did want to cut it (because you think you'll feel more comfortable about it having a larger gap), it is easily done as that edge is not structural.

The standard factory injectors are used, no need to change them.  The kit comes with a new Aluminium Intake Tube that has the MAF sensor mounted on to it.  At the other end is a 200mm HKS Domed Air Intake that sits behind the Vehicle Air Intake.  You also re-flash the ECU with a new tune to accomodate the larger capacity blower.  The kit is great value for money when compared to other options.  I was overwhelmed with just how much difference it made to the performance of the car.

I don't particularly run an AFR gauge in this car (I did in previous cars) but given my understanding of the tuning development that SSC did, there is no way they would take the risk of running this lean.  If anything, they've been conservative and taken the safe option. 

I'll take some close up photos in the morning for you.

On a slightly different topic, please understand that SSC are a very experienced Lotus organisation. They are the largest official Lotus dealer in Australia and I would estimate that about 75% of Lotus sold in Australia are sold through them. They also support Race cars in National car racing series, develop a range of upgraded parts and have a substantial number of experienced Lotus skilled staff, including highly skilled Engine Tuners.  They are not some "back-yard" operation that just fiddle with cars every now and then.

Edited August 12, 2016 by Aussie

[Aussie]

Ok guys, here are a few more photos.  All pretty self explanatory.  The picture of the HKS Filter is to show what the Head of the Filter looks like because in the installed picture all you can see is the back of the Filter body.

 

[Xisthos]

Thanks for the pictures, especially the one where you showed the view from the cabin. I was really curious to see how the resulting visibility was going to be. 

[French Frie]

@Aussie: many thanks for having taken the pics, Mark  ... The rear view is very useful, indeed, as I was afraid it was worse (as owning a roadster, I don't have that silly wing behind ) !

[Aussie]

No worries.  To be honest, I don't find at all that the rear view is blocked by the S/C as the height increase is really quite minimal.  If anything, the wing blocks the view more.  So if you have a Hairdresser's Roadster () then you won't have an issue with visibility.

[French Frie]

... Yep, and As an hairdresser, I want a bigger blower ... But to undress others's hairs   !  TBH, and I know I belong to a minority , but I really prefer aesthically the roadster, and it suits my requirements regarding the road use I have ( bumpy roads, speed bumps,...) ... As you can see, I stay hairdressed anyway  ! 

 

PS: and I already drove it 13.000 kilometers in one year ... And it's not my only toy !

[Aussie]

Ha Ha !!!   Just so you know, in Australia we always make fun of our friends like that saying that they have hairdresser's cars, so just in fun !  I am very jealous of that photo though - where I live, we never have the opportunity of snow.  In summer it gets up as high as 44 degrees celcius and rarely gets below about 5 degrees in Winter.  By the way, the Red Leather looks good with the Carbon Grey.  I encourage you to seriously consider the SSC TVS1900.  It is great value for money with the performance gains you will see.

[French Frie]

No problem, nothing to prove ... Same expression here ("garçon-coiffeur") !  

The upgrade is very tempting,... But it may be costly if imported ( shipping, custom taxes and VAT), and above all, it makes the car illegal here ( I can live with that) and unassured (far more crucial ) !  Mmmhhh ... I'll think about it for its 2 years anniversary, and maybe Lotus will have released the Exige 4XX at that time (dreaming is for free)  !

Edited August 13, 2016 by French Frie

[Xisthos]

Obviously this is all particularly useful to me for the reasons stated above. However I haven't even received my unit yet so I will probably be looking at this somewhere down the line. I'd like to enjoy the car in its somewhat stock form first before doing anything drastic.

Now, since one of the first upgrades I'll probably do is to change the manifold and decat the exhaust, I was curious to know that if the system works particularly better or has been developed with certain brands (2bular, Larini, etc) than others?