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The Evora 400 Diaries


JayEmm

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Agree that London is different to most other places. A Ferrari is nothing very unusual and I swear in some parts of west london there are streets with more Porsches than Fords. i know what you mean about the pleasure in driving something that attracts positive attention, that starts petrol station conversations every time. i love that aspect of ownership. So far the Evora has been a big hit :)  

Most positive attention I ever got was for my Gallardo though, people loved it. 

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That's why I bought the Evora, I didn't really think it would generate the interest that it did but it felt more special to me than the other vehicles tested at the time. It was ALSO much better to drive, which was a massive factor. Initially I wanted something that was just bat shit fast in a straight line but the Lotus kept drawing me back to it.

I wanted to buy a car that if *I* saw it in a car park I would have to give it a closer look, I didn't think I would get that with much else. Spending that amount of money I didn't want to feel like I bad nought something ordinary. Still, the level of enthusiasm Joe Public has for it really did take me by surprise.

Also, I decided a Gallardo would probably ruin me!

James Martin (JayEmm)
Director of Photography & Car Enthusiast

Follow my Lotus adventure online! www.jayemm.com

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I may be getting confused between image and experience, but my 996 GT3 Clubsport was a more exciting, special, challenging adventure every time I got in it versus my 400.

As stated earlier I think the 400 is not getting its deserved recognition. The whole point of it in my eyes, is that it truly is an alternative to a fairly bogo 911. When compared to this, the 400 is a more unique and exciting experience.

it is however, not a Mezger screaming flat six (with Titatanium top end components) Clubsport with only power steering and ABS to help you along.

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For me the appeal of attention from others doesn't last very long. I will always answer any questions posed by anyone I meet, but the only attention I get a buzz out of is when it's part of a conversation from someone who is knowledgeable and has something to add, or someone who is an enthusiast and wants to be Lotus educated. For everyone else, it's polite smile or nod, before I'm off to enjoy the drive.

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But it isn't meant to be. It's almost 20 years newer to start with and is designed as an every day GT/sportscar rather than a track slag. The exige is there to 'compete' with the GT3, although given the prices it's a no brainer in my view. I'd never buy a 996 GT3 (or a 997), most have lead hard lives, look like they have lived most of their mileage on track - and when I was doing loads of trackdays 6 or 7 years ago there were always masses of 996/997 GT3s - and the current price for an average one is ridiculous. 

And, a new engine when that oh so special Metzger lunches itself is over £40,000!!! And that was 4 years ago after talking to a poor bloke at Donnington who's 997 GT3s engine had let go...

Edited by Gashead1105
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I guess I'm pointing out that there is a big difference between a GT race car and a bogo 911. It seems you might also agree?

as I have said, I think the 400 is a far more attractive package than a bogo 911. For the record, I don't have interest in the new Porsche GT cars. The 7RS was probably the last drivers car.

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Yes, I do! 

I have driven a 997.1 a fair bit, my father in law has a garage queen that he very occasionally get's out and even more occassionally let's me drive, and while it's very nice - like a golf GTI is nice - it doesn't excite me. 400 on the other hand is fab and I want one. 

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And for the record, I think Pork pricing is nuts.

Anyways - this is a Lotus forum. My 4 year old thinks the 400 is a Lamborghini and insists on his mother sitting in the back with him upfront and I can't stop driving it at every opportunity. It's living up to its claim as a daily driver very well. Nothing quite like a healthy drive home in the evening after getting off the train, with the pipes open on the twisties.

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I have around 70,000 miles in 5 different GT3 variations and they are fantastic rewarding exciting drivers cars that deserve all the accolades they get. They are all substantially different in character to vanilla 911s. They really do not attract the attention of the general public. If its the aforementioned petrol pump conversation you are after look elsewhere. 

what attracts me about lotus is much of the same TBH. Great dynamics , developed by engineers who clearly "get" what is required to make a great drivers car. 

Exige does compete with GT3 and arguments can be made to favour either, certainly a close call. 

As to the current prices of used GT Porsches, that's a product of their reputations in a very hot market and little to do with Porsche, or in some cases merit. £140k for a 997.1 RS against £80k for a regular 997.1 GT3 is completely unfounded in any rational way, the 2 cars are 99% the same.

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2 hours ago, GER said:

I may be getting confused between image and experience, but my 996 GT3 Clubsport was a more exciting, special, challenging adventure every time I got in it versus my 400.

As stated earlier I think the 400 is not getting its deserved recognition. The whole point of it in my eyes, is that it truly is an alternative to a fairly bogo 911. When compared to this, the 400 is a more unique and exciting experience.

it is however, not a Mezger screaming flat six (with Titatanium top end components) Clubsport with only power steering and ABS to help you along.

Funnily enough I had a 997.1  GT3 Clubsport and after initial excitement , soon became bored of it at "normal" speeds on the road. Would have actually preferred a standard 911 for road use.  Unfortunately I never took it on track where I knew it would shine. 

Going back 4-5 years now since I sold it for low £50's. I remember looking at a couple of RS versions up for sale at £75k with super low miles that hadn't sold for 6 months plus.  Speculators have driven prices mad. 

Personalky I find the Evora 400 so much more engaging on the road and feel it has real presence. Still makes me smile 7 months into ownership, which is pretty rare for me with cars..... get bored easily ;)  Note you have an Ultima....tried building one of those and gave up lol. 

IMG_1187.JPG.8a182147150535abacad35252886a9aa.JPG

Edited by DJW

Previously owned :Exige 380,  Exige 350,  Evora 400,  Exige V6S,  Esprit GT3,  2-11 SC,  Evora S,  Elite 501

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3 hours ago, JayEmm said:

My definition of special takes into consideration how the general public perceive the car.

My Evora has distracted people from a Carrera GT.

Having driven 911 GT3s etc... I love driving them and they feel awesome to drive, but the whole experience is not special. Even a GT3 RS doesn't draw the attention of a 400. That is a big part of it for me.

Don't take my word for it, ask @mcx!

 I agree with @dblue .. I do think the Evora is a much more eye catching shape than a 911, the unfamiliarity of the shape makes people double take, whereas a 911 is much more common. I think both are special in their different ways, the engineering of the 991 RS is pretty amazing, the engine is a beast, sounds great and everything works as intended. The Evora is special in a different way, the driving position, sitting forward in the car with a great view probably sums it up for me, also the lovely ride/handling balance. The engine is not as special as the RS but the Evora is worth about 1/4 of the price, which is mad.  I personally would not agree that driving a 911 is not special (yes I get that this is a Lotus forum) but I do understand the reasoning. Having said all this, I sold the RS and kept the Evora :)

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Special to drive =/= special car

 

I've driven many Porsches which were stunning to drive. Although I often disagree with Porsche types as to which cars those are

James Martin (JayEmm)
Director of Photography & Car Enthusiast

Follow my Lotus adventure online! www.jayemm.com

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3 minutes ago, DJW said:

Funnily enough I had a 997.1  GT3 Clubsport and after initial excitement , soon became bored of it at "normal" speeds on the road. Would have actually preferred a standard 911 for road use.  Unfortunately I never took it on track where I knew it would shine. 

 

Not the first time I've heard people say that about GT3s. Personally don't quite get that. Maybe I'm an irresponsible hooligan but wringing the last bit out of my GT3s was entirely possible from time to time on the road , as was getting the car near to its admittedly considerable limits on a suitably quiet road.

As a car in traffic or clogged up roads its clearly inferior to a regular 911 but well worth the heavy clutch, very limited ground clearance and much reduced NVH levels just to hear it run out 8500 rpm , one of THE greatest engines ever made.

my Evora is much more versatile but shares the delicious steering, feel and interaction of GT cars whilst sounding just about as good.Its probably a match for a 997 GT3 in a straight line too , or pretty close to it.

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Agree when driven hard the GT3 is amazing, but speeds are prison sentence material.  Driven at legal speeds it just didn't do it for me. 

Previously owned :Exige 380,  Exige 350,  Evora 400,  Exige V6S,  Esprit GT3,  2-11 SC,  Evora S,  Elite 501

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10 hours ago, DaveC72 said:

It's an interesting thought process.  I  have a bunch of friends who all think that a Lotus is a special car, but would never buy one.  Their obvious choice is a Porsche something-or-other.  Because it's a Porsche.

When pushed on this, words like "impractical", "reliability", and annoyingly "the Porsche is the better car"  get trotted out like the tired cliche's they are.

To be fair, my experience with the Evora has gone a long way to changing some of these views - but I can pretty much guarantee that, when pushed, they'd still choose the Porker.

I often ponder why this is so, and keep coming back to the same conclusion:  Most people are inherently risk adverse, whether that risk is perceived or actual.  Buying the "wrong" car is just unacceptable to them, even though on the whole they would never get around to buying the Porsche anyhow.  Herd mentality anyone?

Oh, and I'm not anti-911/Porsche per se.  They just don't, on the whole, float my boat.  I can admire them for the engineering prowess and "complete" package that they are (Trademark: your local Bar-bore), but having driven a bunch of various iterations of 911s, Caymans an Boxsters I can honestly say I found them a bit sterile.  I'm far from a driving god, but I do like to be a bit more involved in getting from A to B.

Ironically I see the same attitude from you towards Porsche as your friends towards Lotus... brand preconception.

Cars change with each generation. If you want people to pay attention to the actual cars that Lotus is making right now, you have to follow suit and examine each Porsche model rather than labelling the whole brand as the safe choice for the risk-adverse.

I did this recently with several test drives and found the 991.1 C2S to be a disappointment compared to my (at the time) Evora S. I then upgraded to the Evora 400 as it was an incremental step above the S. However recently I tried the 991.2 C2S and holy crap, it hasn't just leapfrogged the S but also the 400 in terms of driving engagement. Then you add the typical Porsche layers of refinement and technology on top of that and it's a perfect car that can be enjoyed at all speeds.

To have such broad brand bias is to freeze oneself in a moment of time. Companies are constantly evolving their products and just as we gave Lotus a chance, we owe it to ourselves to give Porsche and other brands a chance.

Does this make the 991.2 a "special" car? No, it just makes it the most appealling, well-rounded, enjoyable sports car for me, a person that will only be able to afford a few fancy cars in their whole lifetime. When I think "special" I think McLaren, Lamborghini, Ferrari, Pagani, Koenigsegg et al.

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2016 Evora 400 | Signature Silver on Red Alcantara

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chylid,

Interesting that you make this point.  The 2 cars on my "radar screen" to potentially replace my current ride are the Evora 400 and the 991.2 GTS.  In its lightest form, the GTS is just marginally heavier than the Evora, but has much more mid-range torque.  As far as I'm concerned, the addition of turbs have made the 911 a far more enjoyable road car due to the improved torque curve. If they were priced similarly, it would be hard to pass on the Porsche.  But of course the Porsche is $30,000 more expensive.

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The entry price is much higher but you are rewarded with more breadth of capability. It's much more relaxing when you're not pushing, yet much more visceral when you are. Priced similarly it would be a non-contest.

Here in Australia the 400 is ~$200k vs the GTS at ~$320k. A brand new McLaren 540C is ~$380k so while I have huge respect for the 991.2, my next purchase may be my last and I want something special.... :stuart:

2016 Evora 400 | Signature Silver on Red Alcantara

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@chylld.  It's a fair point, well made.  

In my defence, I did test drive a couple of the Porsche alternatives to my second hand Evora S that were of the same budget to check I wasn't missing the obvious.

I think my point, perhaps less well made, was that the brand bias is much less likely to work the other way in that a prospective Porsche owner, with my kind of spending power, is much less likely to check out a Lotus just in case they are missing something.

 

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1 minute ago, DaveC72 said:

I think my point, perhaps less well made, was that the brand bias is much less likely to work the other way in that a prospective Porsche owner, with my kind of spending power, is much less likely to check out a Lotus just in case they are missing something.

Agree 100% if said Porsche owner is coming from a 911. With sufficient spending power they will be looking up to the next best thing, not down to the next best compromise.

GT3, GT3RS, or a new brand entirely at a slightly higher price point. I can only speak for the Australian market, but once you get into GT3 or higher territory, cars begin to hold their values much better and the depreciation hit isn't as massive as a regular 911 or any modern Lotus. This makes the man maths much easier :)

2016 Evora 400 | Signature Silver on Red Alcantara

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True that with a 911 GTS budget you'd be doing man maths on the next level up more than sensibly looking at a great alternative thats usefully cheaper. But its not really true that the marques from the next level don't suffer big depreciation, they certainly do from new. The exception is GT Porsches because , ironically, IF you can actually get one they are ridiculous VFM , 991.1 GT3 listed at £105k, the RS at £135k. They are sure fire investments at that level. 

Cars in the £200k bracket will easily lose £30k in year one, even the copper bottomed ones. A Mac 650S Spider would have cost £235k in 2014 would sell retail 2 years later at £170k (so the owner might get a bid of £155k) thats the entire list price of an Evora 400. 

 

 

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^^^ this is very important yes... I have a good friend who has done exactly that on 2 macs (one was written off, not his fault) but a LOT of cash over 4 years on 2 cars. I was lucky, picked a 991 50th anniversary, had for 2 years cost nothing in depreciation, got an RS allocation, which made some cash, first time ever for me.. appreciation. I'm pretty sure that Porsche GT cars will be ok at holding values in the future, but I also have concerns that they will up the production numbers and they will depreciate (slowly) in the future. The Evora at late 50s £ will be pretty slow from here I think. Easily the most important  consideration for running and keeping a car unless doing loads and loads of track days. Also means that if you change your mind ( I have a habit of doing this from time to time) then the hit will not be too bad. 

 

 

 

Edited by Bibs
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996/997 GT3's are the best sports cars made the last 15 years imho. 

Pretty unique, race car engine/gearbox combination with rear engine and screaming Mezger. Much more rewarding when driven hard than almost else out there. Reliable out of box too. Epic car! 

The evora is "only" another good mid-engine car without specialness. 

Price wise the 997 gt3 is even at double the price of the 400 a bargain. 

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2 hours ago, DK7 said:

race car engine

Please stop calling a road car'it has race car engine'.No road car has.It is just blocks.And you can get a 'race engine' from an ordinary block if you want.

Edited by nerobi
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