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wrong time to be an engineer in the UK


lotusesprit1

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Got cold emailed an "asset list" from a recruitment agent (never liked referring to people as assets)

I could not believe the salaries. They are not that dissimilar to the salaries being offered back in the late 90's

probably 10-20% more, is that right? So glad I got out when I did.

From the short form they look like highly skilled and qualified people.  

 

 

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Yes sadly true, but most salaries have also gone down in other trades also, you only have to look at day rates for sparkys and plumbers on building sites that the local site labourer is not far of his wage, like anything else you just have to find a company to pay you what you are worth. Specialist welding rates have also dropped, mostly due to agencies getting envolved.  Lots has changed for the working man with a few skill sets under his belt sadly.

A

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Same in the US. When I was last looking several years ago I found they wanted you to do everything and work long hours and not pay for it. However senior management is making more than ever. Poor graduates have huge loans to pay off and salaries that don't help. Be further ahead by skipping school and flipping burgers !!!

So glad I'm retired. 

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As you have said Bob,  years ago you used to have an electrical engineer and a mechanical engineer on site, now they want dual qualified folks for the same money , the same hours and all the work done in the same time by one man :(

 

A

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I've worked in recruitment for 17 years and never called a candidate an 'asset'! 

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most agencies are terrible these days.......

I too am and engineer...........Civil/Structural......so have had calls from agencies wanting a mech or elec or hvac or piping etc etc etc....

they seem to be manned by kids who refuse to read your CV first......

The Faster You Drive...The Slower You Age

(Albert Einstein  14 March 1879 - 18 April 1955)

 

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Gareth just stated the true facts,  some people in agencies do not have a clue what the people they are looking for to fill the clients postion do not understand what qualifactions are needed or the extent of experiance and knowledge said persons would require to suceed to the clients expectations in that  role.

A

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  • Gold FFM

Same here in IT. The recruitment agencies take Grads in, give them a telephone book and say call companies in here and then give them access to their database of candidates. They have to make x number of calls per day and x number of placements a week or they are fired.

I have absolutely no sympathy for these recruitment consultants - kids in nappies would be a better term for them - as half of them do not seem to be able to read. Half of them do not seem to be able to hold a conversation of any depth or sense. Half of them are half wits and half of them can't do the math.  And that then leaves us with the half who are just totally useless fookwits!

There are the exceptions. The recruitment guys who really know their market - customers and candidates, they are worth their weight in gold. They know the  best candidates, the best jobs, the best companies and they work hard to get the right match as it enhances their reputation all around. Sadly, they are a dying breed.

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

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2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

Half of them are half wits and half of them can't do the math.  And that then leaves us with the half who are just totally useless fookwits!

I guess you fit into the middle half? :) 

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It's getting there......

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3 hours ago, theelanman said:

most agencies are terrible these days.......

I too am and engineer...........Civil/Structural......so have had calls from agencies wanting a mech or elec or hvac or piping etc etc etc....

they seem to be manned by kids who refuse to read your CV first......

So what you are saying is that you are an Engineer, not an engineer... Used to rile my old man as well (Structural Engineer)

A Lotus is for driving, pork is for breakfast.

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lol......

yes Engineer....or Designer.....get called allsorts these days....(don't say it!!!).....the recruiter seems to redefine your job title weekly just because it makes them think they're doing something I guess......

also gives them chance to retitle themselves......thats why 16 year olds are office practice managers.......

got chuff all to do with ability....just whats the best and most important job title you can give yourself that no one understands......

don't forget that this is all down to companies in the first place.......they used to have a HR/personnel dept......this is now just farmed out probably because its cheaper.........the service you get certainly is

The Faster You Drive...The Slower You Age

(Albert Einstein  14 March 1879 - 18 April 1955)

 

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I consider myself an asset, rather than an engineer. A company hires me and then places me in a country to do engineering work, but while I'm onsite I also do the finance meetings, training, and installation work, whilst also searching for other 'in country' assets which could be valuable when I'm in a diplomatic pickle. Which only seems to happen in the Middle East for me.

...And yes recruitment agencies are quite poor.

FYI - Here in Oz an engineer in their 40's is looking at a wage around Au$90k - 110k. Or if you work in Mining and can handle a FIFO job then expect  Au$140 - 170K.

Simon  (94 S4)      My Esprit will be for sale in late 2017

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I'm currently looking for an engineer, and very concerned as to whether I'll be able to find one that suits. Anyone who's any good in the field is usually employed, and I'm not looking forward to it.

Some of the applications are laughable:- "I' haven't got a CV, but if I get the job, I'll get one done." Yes, seriously.

Margate Exotics.

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22 minutes ago, ian29gte said:

"I haven't got a CV, but if I get the job, I'll get one done."

You're 'avin a laff!  Someone actually said that?

British Fart to Florida, Nude to New York, Dunce to Denmark, Numpty to Newfoundland.  And Shitfaced Silly Sod to Sweden.

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Crazy world , will have to remember that about cvs , what a classic  :P

42 minutes ago, s4simon said:

I consider myself an asset, rather than an engineer. A company hires me and then places me in a country to do engineering work, but while I'm onsite I also do the finance meetings, training, and installation work, whilst also searching for other 'in country' assets which could be valuable when I'm in a diplomatic pickle. Which only seems to happen in the Middle East for me.

...And yes recruitment agencies are quite poor.

FYI - Here in Oz an engineer in their 40's is looking at a wage around Au$90k - 110k. Or if you work in Mining and can handle a FIFO job then expect  Au$140 - 170K.

Mining is very tempting in oz, Plenty of spare cash,  they used to use landrover defenders underground for a year then throw them in the hole and buy another brand spanker to replace it . :(  Four in four off sounds ideal :thumbup:

A

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34 minutes ago, Sparky said:

You're 'avin a laff!  Someone actually said that?

 

Yup, absolutely true, and in writing.

 

Another one applied saying that he wasn't sure what the job title meant, but he'd "be prepared to have a go at it".

One phoned to complain he hadn't been given an interview, saying that he was used to driving boats up the beach with the Royal Marines'. I had to point out that I have no intention of letting our boats anywhere near beaches.

Another one, in interview, asked what might be a cause of low engine oil pressure, stated "It'll be the piston rings, mate."

Another one, when asked what marine engineering experience he had, said "I've messed about with an outboard motor for a couple of hours."

Bearing in mind the job involves some van driving, one bloke in interview said he hadn't got a driving licence at the moment, but with any luck he would get it back in a couple of year's time.

Oh, and one bloke who was up for a possible 4-year apprenticeship, walked in the door late, and announced "Will this take long, only I've got a dentist's appointment in half an hour."

 

It's laughable, but this is what falls out of the trees when you shake them round these parts. Caveat emptor.

 

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Margate Exotics.

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No i know that Ian,  Its a saying that means its so totally crazy, you could not make it up . :thumbup:   Some people are just stupid and just shows how the workplace has changed, turning up late is just ridiculous,  jesus i have done dry runs in the car a few days prior to interviews to check traffic and route etc !  

I can well imagine the boot neck on about the beach landinds,  good blokes though and full of plenty of banter :thumbup:

A

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1 hour ago, ian29gte said:

I'm currently looking for an engineer, and very concerned as to whether I'll be able to find one that suits. Anyone who's any good in the field is usually employed, and I'm not looking forward to it.

Some of the applications are laughable:- "I' haven't got a CV, but if I get the job, I'll get one done." Yes, seriously.

I am an engineer and have actually two CV's and it all depends on who's has a vacancy. Studied for year's to get a diploma at 40+ year's old. Now only to be told I am overqualified, too old or my experience is not whats being asked for. The last one I can accept. The other two, crock of sheet. Where are the young guys going to get their experience form if not from us older guys. And as for salaries, in my line they have been cut drastically, in some cases as much as 40% in the last 12 month's and working hours increased to a 14 hr day for the same day rate. Multi discipline is now the match word. Mechanical engineer with electrical, electronics experience. 30+ year's, more certificates than you can count and to be told, Oh, they dont apply to onshore work. It's the same bloody job, with the same skill's, but probably carried out to a far higher standard than onshore, simply because if we cock up we can shut down a multi million pound project for day's at a time waiting for parts. Onshore, call a supplier, send a driver pick it up, job done. Offshore, even in UK waters. Hire a chopper to fly it out 50 k, send it on a boat and get it in 3 days 150K. And if your oversea's in some of the countries I have worked in, charter a plane and fly it out 50k, then it get's stuck in some corrupt customs department for a minimum of 3 weeks, or you pay a massive backhander, by the time you get it it's probably cost hundreds of thousands in downtime. Employment agencies. Dont even get me started on that one. My field of expertise is in mechanical and highly influenced with regulations due to lifting operations and safety factors with hundreds more regulations, yet I get emails with offers of work trades which have nothing to do with what I am qualified for. For instance I have a high level operators certificate, mechanical and engineering degree, so the word operators triggers something within the agency offices and I get offered Bar organiser, printer operator, cement truck operator plus many more. Cant these clones read or understand what it say's on a CV or in your experience brief.

Whatever you do, never send a CV as a PDF, the automated systems with these agencies don't recognise it as text, they look at it as a photograph and it's kicked out. Learn to use bullet point words and not just a paragraph, as once again, the system does not see it and it goes in the electronic bin. This is what I have found after months of looking for work and then finally asking a few agencies why my CV is never registered.

 

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38 minutes ago, ian29gte said:

 

Yup, absolutely true, and in writing.

 

Another one applied saying that he wasn't sure what the job title meant, but he'd "be prepared to have a go at it".

One phoned to complain he hadn't been given an interview, saying that he was used to driving boats up the beach with the Royal Marines'. I had to point out that I have no intention of letting our boats anywhere near beaches.

Another one, in interview, asked what might be a cause of low engine oil pressure, stated "It'll be the piston rings, mate."

Another one, when asked what marine engineering experience he had, said "I've messed about with an outboard motor for a couple of hours."

Bearing in mind the job involves some van driving, one bloke in interview said he hadn't got a driving licence at the moment, but with any luck he would get it back in a couple of year's time.

Oh, and one bloke who was up for a possible 4-year apprenticeship, walked in the door late, and announced "Will this take long, only I've got a dentist's appointment in half an hour."

 

It's laughable, but this is what falls out of the trees when you shake them round these parts. Caveat emptor.

 

I had to employ 54 rigger's in my last position oversea's and some we re real cracker's. Certificates obviously downloaded of the internet. One guy came in and via a translator I asked what his experience was. I was a security guard on the river. How does that make you a rigger, I used to tie up the nets for the poachers. Not a word of a lie, that was his response. Another for the same position was when I gave him a trade test to complete. Sorry I cant write that out, why, because I cant write. For 54 position's, I had to interview and trade test almost 200 people, all of whom were fully certified and came with references.

Prime example, this is what I was sent from one agency this morning. I was applying for a position as an offshore engineer, they came back and said the following were currently recruiting. Never knew Aldi, House of Fraser etc had stores offshore.

 

 

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We had a new member of staff start on Monday, all seemed fine until she e-mailed early Tuesday to say that she was resigning as she didn't like the drive to work. The journey from her house takes 20 minutes and is along good roads, and she must have driven it at least twice to come for interviews.

Unbelievable.

 

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Interviewed a chap a few years ago now for an IS technician who had to work within a team. I asked what he would do if he had a disagreement that needed resolving with a team member. Expecting the stock answer of discuss it with the individual and try and sort between themselves, if not and he felt it necessary escalate it to the Team Leader, etc.. etc.. I was surprised with the answer of - if he does not agree with my view I will take round the back of the building and beat the crap out of him. Didn't get the job but made me laugh.

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And there's me thinking I won't bother post-BA.  Looks like I'd breeze it.

Nah, sod it, spanners beckon...

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British Fart to Florida, Nude to New York, Dunce to Denmark, Numpty to Newfoundland.  And Shitfaced Silly Sod to Sweden.

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