Future of Lotus

[TdM]

21 hours ago, LotusLeftLotusRight said:

We knew a while back that it would be a V6, but I think the market will be a bit underwhelmed if Lotus sticks to the old “Toyota Camry” unit for the next generation of cars. I would have preferred a Geeley Group in-house engine and gearbox. Now that we are told it will be the Toyota V6, are we safe in assuming another transverse layout? Again, I hope not. Otherwise it will probably just be regarded as a re-body of the already long-in-the-tooth existing products.

Agree that the old engine is getting a little long in the tooth for a new car it must be suffering on emissions by now. I do wonder though if Geely have anything that would be suitable at this time without electrification.The only other engine they could provide I think would be a 2.0l supercharged/turbocharged engine from Polestar that produces in the high 300's hp I think. It's probably a bit big with all that hardware onboard to fit amidships and may not be able to reach the top end figures they want, let alone the driveability characteristics they are looking for.

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

I think somewhere back in this thread Nedasay told us that there is indeed a V6 in the Geeley portfolio. Lotus and/or Volvo Polestar could have had a fiddle with that to see what figures they could achieve.

[PAR]

As I understand it, performance had been much more limited by gearbox issues than by the engine.

there are many versions of the Toyota V6 currently in use so emissions would not necessarily be an issue. I imagine they would want to minimise costs and maximise reliability by using something they know as much as possible. There is also a 4.0l version of the Toyota engine so it could be handy as well to have some chassis that can welcome different versions.

it is pretty clear that a car over 100k will need a 500+bhp engine. That should be possible with the Toyota sourcing (I would not be surprised if this means not manual gearbox though).

[TdM]

On investigation you are correct, there is a Geely V6. Not sure how advanced it is vs the Toyota block (not a lot of info about) but the car it was in was FF so I presume that it's also designed for transverse installation.

 

As PAR alludes to, Toyota engines have always been tough and capable of taking huge power if you fancy doing the work on them and I suspect the current engine is fully capable of some serious numbers with a suitable gearbox attached. Looking at the 4.0 it looks like it's got a longer stroke making the engine a lot 'squarer' so might not have the character of a sports car engine being a bit more lazy.

Bigger 'charger on the 3.5 maybe?

[Bee]

Whilst it would be fantastic to see 500+bhp, I suspect the Achille's heel of the Toyota engine set-up is indeed the gearbox; if they believed that the current gearbox could have been strengthened enough to reliably handle it, then we would surely have seen a 500bhp Evora/Exige (instead of the 430 variants). They would have been incredibly desirable propositions!

 

I can only assume that there is no easy answer to the gearbox issue or Komo-Tec et al. would be offering it, even if it was not viable for Lotus themselves?

[TdM]

I do have some concern about whether this car is going to be confused and what market it's targeting... But we shall see!

[Likuid]

Yes this information is a bit perplexing. While I have no issue with them continuing to use a Toyota engine, using the exact same engine currently is confusing. If this car is a successor to the Evora then IMO it needs 500HP if the price is going to be $100k+. Since Lotus stopped at 430 and only made limited amounts at that power level I don't think they are confident to go past that with the current setup. I was hoping with it possibly being their last ICE that they would do something a bit different. I have a feeling this is going to end up being a re-skinned Evora. That isn't a bad thing if the price drops, but I don't see that working at current price considering Evora barely can sell at that price.

That being said this could be a red herring for all we know. I am excited to see what they do, I just hope they do it right.

[jep]

I thought it was public knowledge that the next car is Evora based, I assume that means platform. 

Justin 

[Likuid]

I think most people assumed it meant mainly the chassis was going to be shared, not just a re-skinned Evora with another name.

[TdM]

The Lotus Evira will start at 55k for a 3.5v6 'Evira 280' and move on through the supercharged 'Evira 401' all the way up to the 'Evira 430.5' at the top end...

You can get it in 2+0 or 2+2 configuration.

I hope it doesn't happen, but I'm worried.

[62dave]

I like the sound of an entry level Evira 280 - where can I put a deposit down?

[Mark030358]

2.0l 4 pot turbo.... no brainer.

[comem47]

Instead of an Evira, how 'bout an Elvira 2 pot ?    (salt & pepper shakers)

😉

 

[calvan]

That's a unique setup - Twin Hemi.

[Nexus]

The Type 131 has been announced!

Autoexpress - New 2021 Lotus Type 131 to join line-up between Exige and Evora

Edited August 19, 2020 by Nexus

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

Autoexpress = yawn.

[jonwat]

Autoexpress 😀

[stephenwhyte]

There should be a law against fictitious “how it could look” pictures - they get right on my wick, and the reason I would never give a penny to Autocar these days. AutoExpress have been much better in this regard but clearly have started to stoop to the same level of fantasy journalism.....🙄

[NedaSay]

On 18/08/2020 at 02:26, LotusLeftLotusRight said:

I think somewhere back in this thread Nedasay told us that there is indeed a V6 in the Geely portfolio. Lotus and/or Volvo Polestar could have had a fiddle with that to see what figures they could achieve.

Yes there's a V6 in the Geely Portfolio, codenamed JLV-6G35 and 35 stands for 3.5l displacement good for some 270 bhp in standard guise. I hinted at the fact that this engine looked like a GR-FE clone,  and the fact that it was codeveloped with Volvo. Today this V6 is only used on a few Geely Emgrand models and mostly it seems on the middle east markets as Geely has shifted its homegrown status "Bo Rui" class vehicles to hybrid.

Now another interesting tidbit, the guy in charge of the car that was first fitted with this engine is none other than current Group Lotus CEO Feng Qingfeng. The same person who established a skunkwork division in Hanghzou on the Geely campus where engines are made and another one in Ningbo where a bunch of subsystems are designed and produced.

They have now been at it for almost 2 years, I'd bet a penny or two  that Lotus engineers have had full access to the schematics of said engine, The engine can be customized to fit Lotus needs and cherry on top the engine would/could only share very little (the block) with the standard engine, the rest could be bespoke to Lotus not just the ECU but engine internals could be made to suit Lotus needs (forged valves, cams, sleeves...) making it very worthy of the Lotus Engineered badge.

So if we take the tidbits from AutosExpress seriously... Yes the engine can either be and inline 4cyl or aV6 and in both case Lotus won't need to have access to Toyota powertrain. Knowing that the engine is a Toyota may reassure people on some markets but the Volvo seal of reliability should not deter that many people either. Time will tell.

[Jason is Chasing]

Ouch on the rendering,  but its brilliant there is confirmation of an entry level Lotus, I imagine in the end with my limited experience in a Lotus Vehicle it will be an absolute weapon. 

 Auto Express puts out some pretty wild renderings, I hope they're pretty far off the mark on this one, there is something I8'esque about this, that is a bit of a turn off for me.

I've heard the same myself that it will be done on the Evora chassis and a Volvo powerhouse, so its nice to see that confirmed in some regard here

[Bibs]

2 minutes ago, Jason is Chasing said:

they're pretty far off the mark on this one

[Jason is Chasing]

On 15/08/2020 at 04:40, mg4lotus said:

@Jason is Chasing see above

Thanks for this, I'm currently actively seeking a used Evora 400, I tried to figure out my finances to work on the GT however in the end I would have to liquidate something more than my 4c, and I wasn't comfortable with that.  While I thought that search would be easier,  it's still a bit of a challenge,  and given my travel limitations at work I would be required to take an out of state Dealers word on the vehicle. 

 

I need some Lotus in my life, so heres crossing my fingers!

4 minutes ago, Bibs said:

I do hope so!  

[mg4lotus]

I think the Autoexpress images have a feel of the M100 Elan about them. Then they've just added some of the porosity features from the Evija. It looks too busy and retrograde, IMO.

[NedaSay]

The AutoExpress rendering is a ripoff DB intent prototype Elan... They are pretty happy with it but I think it is not going to look much like that at all.

When it comes to the architecture of the thing I can't wait to see how much of the chassis they have really changed, and how much of the Geely group they have infused... Volvo carbon spine comes to mind amongst other things.

[Jason is Chasing]

 

https://carbuzz.com/news/get-excited-for-new-lotus-sports-car

 

Talk of the town so,