free hit
counters
Future of Lotus - Page 76 - Lotus / Motoring / Cars Chat - The Lotus Forums #ForTheOwners Jump to content


Future of Lotus


Recommended Posts

https://info.south-norfolk.gov.uk/online-applications/files/C5F8F02490F3D4C1605E229B2674FC84/pdf/2018_2147-PROPOSED_SITE_CAR_PARKING-6190094.pdf

Thank you @Chipp for sharing these with me, i've been nerding part of the day.

It is quite fun to see that despite a change in ownership and 2 changes in management some of Dany Bahar initiatives will come to fruition has it appears the skeleton has only be modified cosmetically.

Edited by NedaSay
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Upgrade today to remove Google ads and support TLF.

I wish I shared Nico's optimism but reluctantly share your view Nathan. The focus appears to have changed at Lotus. Many will say that's essential for them to achieve higher volume. But the focus and philosophy at Lotus was what made their cars special. Misunderstood by many but adored by a few. True pioneers don't follow the herd and are often unappreciated at the time. Often unsuccessful too. Human beings are naturally conservative resistant to change. To appeal to a broader market beyond Lotus will have to abandon much of what makes the current cars so special. I believe this is a fundamental mistake based on false assumptions. But car makers don't seem to have any imagination beyond copying what is successful elsewhere, when it comes to sports cars this usually means copy Porsche. SUVs plus unisex, conservatively styled all-rounders. Detune the cars on launch so you can add 10bhp with every new update. Much like the music industry you have clone after clone appearing until you have the great sea of samey blandness until someone comes along who changes the game. Or someone gets more widely recognized for having changed the game years ago.

To be 'misunderstood by many but adored by a few' is a marketing problem. As is the whole thing about people not even knowing what an Evora is. Lotus have limped on with a tiny marketing budget for many years. Imagine what the same cars could achieve with some smart, engaging, truthful, inspiring marketing behind them? The false assumption is that the current Lotus range do not sell in large numbers because they are not good enough cars. Or not what 'the market wants'. It's assumed that if you make a Cayman clone more people will want it because more people buy Caymans. As in, Porsche got it right, Lotus got it wrong. For a brief period in the 1990's TVRs outsold Porsches in the UK. It suddenly became deeply uncool to be seen driving a Porsche around the City. They went the way of the filofax. TVR didn't sell more cars by building a 'better' car or one that was more like Porsche. They benefitted by maintaining what made them different. Lotus could build a car twice as good as a Cayman and it still wouldn't sell at this moment in time. I happen to think the Elise is more than twice as involving to drive already. Until Lotus make the badge desireable to those beyond the hardcore car enthusiast they won't sell many SUVs either. However good. Again, principally a marketing problem. Lotus need to be using this time to lay the foundations of what is to come. Whether deserved or not Lotus have a reputation that needs to be addressed. They are unfairly thought of as poorly built, unreliable, fragile, plastic track toys. It's up to the marketing department to prove people wrong about this. Evija, if successful, should help elevate the brand but so much more needs to be done that will have a more direct effect on public perceptions. As said before I'd like to see regular updates from the factory, press releases, youtube videos, digital and print ads, showing the steps Lotus are taking to radically improve the quality of their cars. Dany Bahar hired an ex Porsche quality control manager. He didn't do anything as far as I remember but it was the right sort of statement to send out there. Imagine a series of youtube videos that detail the changes this new german quality control manager is bringing in. Vital stuff if Lotus is to be taken seriously as a volume sports car maker. Lotus can do a lot to counter the reputation for being unreliable by endurance racing, driving an Evora around the world, increasing the factory warranty, keeping driving an Evora, a 911 and an F-Type until one of them breaks, celebrate high mileage customer cars, start a high mileage league table, reward customers who use their cars. Make something of this 'For The Drivers' thing.

Instead we neither see nor hear anything about the current cars or what is going on at Hethel beyond the very occasional Evija video. Does anyone outside Guangzhou care about the Guangzhou motor show? I don't believe that's enough. Nor will launching a Cayman inspired car or SUV on its own. Maserati and Alfa Romeo have proven that just building an SUV will not guarantee a sales stampede by itself.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM

All fascinating thoughts...…….Lotus Cars cannot survive long-term making less than 2,000 cars per annum, so something has to change. Tricky to have extensive marketing with that low volume, so perhaps the only avenue is to increase sales (which means new product). 

I am open-minded on the process, as my fear is the current situation is not sustainable; even given Lotus Cars legendary ability to survive despite everything.

I hear the cars will be softer, genuine touring cars. In time, I am sure these can be stripped out to appeal to those who currently buy Evora 410/430, if not Exige fans. First of all though, Lotus have to sell these touring cars to a wider audience; I have no idea if they can but I hope they do.

Justin

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
3 hours ago, The Pits said:

Lotus can do a lot to counter the reputation for being unreliable by endurance racing, driving an Evora around the world, increasing the factory warranty, keeping driving an Evora, a 911 and an F-Type until one of them breaks, celebrate high mileage customer cars, start a high mileage league table, reward customers who use their cars. Make something of this 'For The Drivers' thing.

I like this idea. 

Justin

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, The Pits said:

Lotus can do a lot to counter the reputation for being unreliable by endurance racing, driving an Evora around the world, increasing the factory warranty, keeping driving an Evora, a 911 and an F-Type until one of them breaks, celebrate high mileage customer cars, start a high mileage league table, reward customers who use their cars. Make something of this 'For The Drivers' thing.

Yup, I love this too. What we need is a direct line from TLF to Lotus Cars... @Bibs? ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Commanding a higher price is impossible without a strong brand. This is how Porsche can stick their badge on a VW SUV and charge 30% more. How this hasn't irreparably tarnished their brand as a sports car maker is another story but they didn't build their brand making SUVs. They built it with fast, durable sports and racing cars.

I don't think Lotus should copy McLaren's business model but I'd rather they took inspiration from it and stayed committed to sports cars, offering something more like a McLaren at a lower price point (£50k-£150k). That said, I see no reason why Lotus shouldn't compete with McLaren further down the track. The Evija if successful will sit above anything McLaren makes currently. McLaren and Alpine seem to be doing well out of taking inspiration from Lotus. Alpine A110 is outselling Cayman currently. I just want Lotus themselves to go forward with some confidence about their values and principles which are as valid and compelling now as they ever were. So much they could and should be doing long before the first new model comes out.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wonder if they'll ever put the blinker and wiper stalks so that the blinker stalk is on the right hand side of the steering wheel? :getmecoat: 

  • Haha 1

All we know is that when they stop making this, we will be properly, properly sad.Jeremy Clarkson on the Esprit.

Opinions are like armpits. Everyone has them, some just stink more than others.

For forum issues, please contact one of us Moderators.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, jep said:

If they think they can sell a Lotus badged sports car (or SUV) for Merc/Porsche price-point, I fear they will be in for a wallet-draining decade.

Overall a very clear and adequate post as all the others from @jep here - I can't agree more with the thinking and logic

7 hours ago, The Pits said:

This is how Porsche can stick their badge on a VW SUV and charge 30% more.

Makes no sense whatsoever (as much as countless number of other empty/pathetic statements in this thread by @The Pits). Not that I think either of a Porsche SUV's as a "hand built in", but one would struggle to find much in common in between those and VW. You may want to try those and see for yourself. :thumbsup:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First flat earthers, then climate change deniers and now VW platform sharing deniers! Unusual thing to take offence at though.

I was going to ask what so bad about using VW group parts but I'd much rather we return to discussing the topic respectfully.

I'd be interested to hear your views about what Lotus should and shouldn't do with their future cars. What future Lotus would make you to trade in your Exige in 18 months time?

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, The Pits said:

what so bad about using VW group parts

This is a more sensible of a statement, although platform sharing and badge engineering are a bit of distant from each other concepts. Hopefully we all understand this. :rolleyes:

1 hour ago, The Pits said:

What future Lotus would make you to trade in your Exige in 18 months time?

This really is a fair and challenging question. I bought an Exige with pretty much a freedom to buy any car up to £100k with really no limitations (only one being able to fit in a small carry on suitcase while driving about 100mi one way). I've been sold on the nature of direct connection to the road (I struggle to drive "fully normal" cars) with decent amount of performance. I'm still very happy with these. Only let down's were multiple unexplainable and unjustifiable quality faults and variable dealers network quality when it comes to service.

I don't think I'm going to change the car in 18 months from now, but I may consider buying one more (new). At the moment the next best most immediate candidate would probably be a baby McLaren in specification to my liking (nothing ridiculous, just the way I'd want it to be), while I'm also keen to see what C8 Corvette (and hopefully soon to be announced Z06) is going to be like; I'd also try to get a feel for R8 V10 and maybe (but less  likely) GT-R or AMG GT. So then for Lotus to really be in the list, it would need to either be a major step up from (but same unique type of) my Sport 350 (manufacturing quality at the level of an average Porsche, 30-50% more power and preserved steering/feeling/weight of a car), or a competitive car with big character (read engine and design) and more GT feel, while also more special driving feel than the alternarives. Both are rather tough things to achieve, admittably.

Edited by vd9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 27/11/2019 at 02:14, NedaSay said:

it may actually be quite light, a shortened Evora with 4 cyl would assuredly be below 1200kg

That's an interesting idea - you've only got to look at the Alpine to see how successful that could be, and potentially it might allow its price point to remain low enough. for the likes of me!  In factm if I were to replace the Evora, the only candidate that comes to mind as a serious proposition is the Alpine A110 (though I am as yet to drive one)

22 hours ago, The Pits said:

Lotus can do a lot to counter the reputation for being unreliable by endurance racing, driving an Evora around the world, increasing the factory warranty, keeping driving an Evora, a 911 and an F-Type until one of them breaks, celebrate high mileage customer cars, start a high mileage league table, reward customers who use their cars. Make something of this 'For The Drivers' thing

This is a great idea BTW!  There are countless venues around the world that could hosts a travelling roadshow.
 

For the wealthier end of the market, the GT4 championship is gaining more and more popularity - is the Evora GT4 still produced / available??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Gold FFM
13 hours ago, vd9 said:

but one would struggle to find much in common in between those and VW

I may be mistaken, but I think you will find that VAG have one shared platform for their SUVs across all brands. The platform is constructed in Slovakia, but final car production varies (Slovakia for Skoda, Leipzig for Porsche etc.). Again, iirc it is designated VAG Group E Type 120.  So pretty hard to deny the core DNA of the chassis in Porsche SUVs as being VAG.

In 2017 it was announced that after intense internal competition in VAG that Porsche and Audi would collaborate on future shared vehicle platforms, modules and components.

This does indeed suggest you will find a lot in common (like the Aston Martin key under Ford ownership that when you took the leather off was branded VW) between the two and that both brand/badge and engineering management is going on.

Next you'll be telling us that the switchgear in the Lamborgini was not Audi, nor the ICE etc.

A point of fact to note though is that Porsche were not sharing their engines. However this will change though with new electrified model as VAG have no confirmed a shared platform across all brands.

I see a similar thing happening with Lotus but deeper - i.e. shared platforms, modules AND engines across the Geely holdings. I even think some tech from the Evija will find its way into Volvo and other SUV's, especially the ability to power 4 wheels from four individual electric engines to do wheel vectoring for turning and drive.

 

 

 

Alcohol. Sex. Tobacco. Drugs. Chocolate.  Meh! NOTHING in this world is as addictive as an Evora +0. It's not for babies!    

The first guy to ride a bull for fun, was a true hero. The second man to follow him was truly nuts!   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Bibs featured and unfeatured this topic

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...