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350 Sport Engine Issue ?


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Someone has an idea of what's happened ? Stunning ?

We have made a preparation on this Lotus Exige S. It is always a pleasure to see these little English cars at home, as many of them have passed into our hands. This is the latest version, the 350 from 2016, still driven by the Toyota 3.5 V6 topped by a compressor. We supplied and installed a Komotec airbox in carbon.

Announced at 350 hp and 400 Nm of torque, we measured it at 283 hp and 363 Nm of torque. After preparation, we reached 380 hp and 436 Nm of torque. The original measured value is quite low, most of the V6 Exige come out around 300-310 hp on the bench for 350 advertised, the reason why the gain is as high without making big changes is that the pressure of the compressor is Run by a wastegate, which is very rare on compressor engines. Moreover, Lotus's engine management is not well-established, especially in terms of the air / fuel ratio, regulated far too rich original.

https://www.facebook.com/VoneRacing/

1502310105-20627086-1674740435900512-435

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1502310112-20689905-1674743239233565-432

 

 

 

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Folks please can we chill and stop antagonising each other as my prediction of another five page thread will come true... I'd rather we talk about how we could organise a great community dyno day t

During a period of three month the engine output continuously decreased as the gas consumption particularly on track assumed alarming proportions  (up to 70 ltr./ 100km in Imola) Lotus experts on

Agree dyno conversation is at least another five page debate It would be nice to get some proper independent dyno tests done. I know 'in my younger days' a lot of the jap car scene used to organi

They say : We supplied and installed a Komotec airbox in carbon.  And they talk about an ECU remapping.

The French text :

Nous avons réalisé une préparation sur cette Lotus Exige S. C'est toujours un plaisir de voir ces petites anglaises chez nous, car nombre d'entre elles sont passées dans nos mains. Il s'agit de la dernière version, la 350 de 2016, toujours mue par le V6 Toyota 3.5 surmonté d'un compresseur.

Nous avons fourni et posé une boite à air Komotec en carbone.

Annoncée à 350 ch et 400 Nm de couple, nous l'avons mesurée à 283 ch et 363 Nm de couple. Après préparation, nous avons atteint 380 ch et 436 Nm de couple.

La valeur mesurée d'origine est assez basse, la plupart des Exige V6 sortent aux alentours de 300-310 ch au banc pour 350 annoncés, la raison pour laquelle le gain est aussi élevé sans faire de grosses modifications est que la pression du compresseur est géré par une wastegate, ce qui est très rare sur des moteurs à compresseur. Et de plus, la gestion moteur de chez Lotus n'est pas bien paramétrée d'origine, surtout au niveau du rapport air/carburant, réglé beaucoup trop riche d'origine.

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I have to say we are back on the dyno thing again.... 25% power increase and 17% increase in torque.... oh my, and on a four wheel dyno too! :cry:

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That's some airbox! Worth 100bhp?! Stretching credibility somewhat!

Dyno tuners are like builders, they always slate the guy who did it before. I've taken my bike to several, the base run was always low, the gains were always massive. I think Monsieur Rotronics might be pushing his luck this time though!

Of course 283bhp is dire if true as is the claim that 300bhp is common (assuming this is at the crank, not the wheels). 283bhp isn't low, it's faulty. He wants to check all the spark plugs are connected!

 

 

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Agree dyno conversation is at least another five page debate ;)

It would be nice to get some proper independent dyno tests done. I know 'in my younger days' a lot of the jap car scene used to organise dyno days where forum members could go get their cars dyno'd.

That could be a very interesting TLF event if we could find a trusted independent dyno operator. 

We have quite a few members now running different states of tune from standard V6, Cups, 350, 380s, SSC air induction, SSC charged, Komotec.

Now if we could get all those variations together to test - That would be a very cool and highly informative event!

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www.alias23.com

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5 minutes ago, alias23 said:

That could be a very interesting TLF event if we could find a trusted independent dyno operator. 

I'm pretty sure that @Hangar 111 would be happy to help put something together, if they can find the time. 

(Unfortunately, however, Suffolk is now a bit far for me to travel now for a dyno run). 

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Good idea Imran, would be interesting to test same car in different days too. I'd like to know the difference between a cold day and a hot one, feels massive subjectively. Hard to replicate on a dyno though, those fans don't do much.

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The original power curve flattens above 5500rpm, this can't be normal. If it would continue more or less linear up to 6500-6800 rpm, the output would be about 350hp, as claimed. This seems to correspond to earlier topics indicating difficulties getting a correct measurement on a dyno. If Vone Racing found a way to get around this, specifically on the dyno, it would instantly make it look very good! Actual gain seems to be more like 10-15%, as indicated by the torque curve. Still nice to have, less impressive but certainly more plausible.

I have made many mistakes in my life. Buying a multiple Lotus is not one of them.

 

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yet another Lotus don't make the BHP posts !  why are these so common ?

 

Serious question as it was not answered on other threads, Hanger 111 stated this from what I remember when they started testing cars.

But I have been away from the Lotus forums for a few years,  but it seems the posts are the same !

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Go on then @430CUP, if you're going to be on here you may as well entertain us. What is your sinister conspiracy theory?

Bearing in mind the base engine makes 296bhp presumably Toyota are lying too and the supercharger Lotus put on the top is fake!

Pray do tell!

 

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19 minutes ago, Seriouslylotus said:

Simply because they are not tested correctly...

Mine makes 351.7BHP at 6915rpm and 407nm of torque at 5002 rpm, pretty much spot on for a 360cup

Hi Dave, can you share who you went to for the dyno?

If you use them then thats sound enough for me that they could be a trustworthy place to organise a forum type dyno event.

www.alias23.com

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40 minutes ago, alias23 said:

Hi Dave, can you share who you went to for the dyno?

If you use them then thats sound enough for me that they could be a trustworthy place to organise a forum type dyno event.

Place called Big fish tuning, They are in North Yorkshire place called Stokesley

http://www.bigfishtuning.co.uk/

The owner is a true petrol head...Does lots of OEM tuning on VAG and BMW's

He has access to the V6 ecu also!!!!!!

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12 hours ago, alias23 said:

It would be nice to get some proper independent dyno tests done. I know 'in my younger days' a lot of the jap car scene used to organise dyno days where forum members could go get their cars dyno'd.

It may actually be even better and cheaper and more fun to rent an old airfield for a day and do proper measurement (0-60, 60-120, 50-120, etc.) day. Acceleration curve is extremely neutral thing to measure and knowing which gear the car is in and what is the car's weight provides a rather unambiguous read on the torque and, consequentially, power the engine makes (at the wheels, which is actually the one that matters and is relatively easy to translate into the flywheel power for 2WD car). I will be able and happy to join this most likely from early November on.

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4 hours ago, The Pits said:

Go on then @430CUP, if you're going to be on here you may as well entertain us. What is your sinister conspiracy theory?

Bearing in mind the base engine makes 296bhp presumably Toyota are lying too and the supercharger Lotus put on the top is fake!

Pray do tell!

 

I don't have the answers do I ?  I read about Lotus cars NOT making BHP, you say they do, then the very next day yet another "my lotus don't make the BHP quoted"  thread pops up. I am NOT posting these thread am I lol ?
why so many threads over 3 to 5 years on the Evora and Exige not making the claimed power ?  It don't add up. esp as Hanger 111 was involved if I remember early on.

If the your car car does and so does Daves then the 360 map is worth looking at over a 350 map, as the 360 is a Motorsport built car it is not ? (guessing here that they were still going then)

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Very disappointing. I wanted to hear about the shapeshifting lizards at Lotus using mind control rays to make you see 345bhp on a spec sheet when really it says 280bhp....

Maybe they use that snake from the Jungle book, who knows? 

Come to think of it, explains quite a lot. I think one of them must have eaten the parts guy...

:D

 

 

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Sorry Imran you're quite right, thought it might be time to lighten the tone. Not much good ever comes out of dyno discussions. 

In the absence of a full understanding of what the ecu is doing on the dyno, two or four wheel, and why it limits the revs, we will have to settle for a comparison of between our individual cars. Highest number below the official figure wins!

:D

 

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As for values that are lower than the manufacturer's quoted figures - how can they be in dispute? Surely Lotus must dyno these to attain the figures which they list? Thus lets test in the way Lotus do, then it must be the same figure that they stick on the back of our cars, surely?

and blending threads....

If a GT4 sits on the dyno and produces XX power and then a 350 sits on the dyno and produces XY power (i.e. different) would that produce a power conclusion?

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48 minutes ago, 430CUP said:

I don't have the answers do I ?  I read about Lotus cars NOT making BHP, you say they do, then the very next day yet another "my lotus don't make the BHP quoted"  thread pops up. I am NOT posting these thread am I lol ?
why so many threads over 3 to 5 years on the Evora and Exige not making the claimed power ?  It don't add up. esp as Hanger 111 was involved if I remember early on.

If the your car car does and so does Daves then the 360 map is worth looking at over a 350 map, as the 360 is a Motorsport built car it is not ? (guessing here that they were still going then)

360 and 350 are identical maps, its the Sport exhaust and air filter that gives it about 5-7 more bhp than a standard

1 hour ago, cbaileyuk said:

As for values that are lower than the manufacturer's quoted figures - how can they be in dispute? Surely Lotus must dyno these to attain the figures which they list? Thus lets test in the way Lotus do, then it must be the same figure that they stick on the back of our cars, surely?

and blending threads....

If a GT4 sits on the dyno and produces XX power and then a 350 sits on the dyno and produces XY power (i.e. different) would that produce a power conclusion?

For me  its...... Who cares?

Manufactures don't get thier figures from a rolling road anyway, they use an engine dyno, usually without all the stuff added that increase losses like AC Compressor, alternator, clutch etc etc

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You don't care, some do care. I read discrepancy talk about our cars power outputs and I also read people looking to find out the answers to these matters.

This isn't a problem for other cars, they just stick em on the dyno and find the value. I've done it on other cars so I don't see the issue.

 

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Like Dave said, manufacturers will use an engine dyno in a lovely dyno cell. A world away from strapping a physical car to a dyno.

Hub dyno's are the next best, as they take the interaction of the tyre and the rollers out of it. These are rare though, A) becuase they are a faff, B) they are harder to manipulate.

Loads of makes have issues when the transition from engine cell to roller dyno is made. Jag being one of them. The F Type V6 and V6S should put out 340bhp and 380bhp respectively, put them both on a dyno and they'll both put out 350ish bhp. Leaving a lot of V6S owners pissed off. Jag to this day say there is still a 40bhp difference while in an engine cell.

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