free hit
counters
Replacing pipes through the chassis on a V8... without removing the engine? - Page 3 - Interior/Exterior/Lights/Glass/Alarms/ICE/HVAC - The Lotus Forums #ForTheOwners Jump to content


Replacing pipes through the chassis on a V8... without removing the engine?


Recommended Posts

Not sure what the difference is but there was no way I could get my old ones out or new ones in without damaging them.

G cars must be different from the S cars.

Margate Exotics.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Upgrade today to remove Google ads and support TLF.
  • Replies 139
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

You make a good point Steve, I will put on my big boy pants and get the old bus rolling.  

While out and about, you met Richard Hammond, who then made an offer you could not refuse to provide much needed spares package for his S350

That's the closest to deserving a beer.       It only went a passed an MOT !!! 🙃 I took it in to get a todo list without checking anything myself beyond the obvious and they g

Posted Images

  • Gold FFM

Looking at those pics, I'll guess yours might be bad inside the chassis.  At this point I'd be taking a look through the master gear change aperture to see if things are wet.

British Fart to Florida, Nude to New York, Dunce to Denmark, Numpty to Newfoundland.  And Shitfaced Silly Sod to Sweden.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

I might send the camera up the pipe and have a look from the inside. Not sure I want to start ripping the interior to pieces until I have to. 

If it can last a little while I can drive it for the summer and then hit a number if items in one big push. Anyone know of a single phases two post lift up for grabs?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know this doesn't particularly help Chris, but that's the job done on a G car (front view).   refitting the new was easier then removing old (you have the full length of pipe as a lever to ease past the chassis member - on removal you have no leverage)

pipes.JPG

Edited by 910Esprit
Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I've seen of these pipes, on my own car and others, is the oxidation seems to only occur under the rubber of the hoses as if there is a reaction between the two substances which rots the ally away. 

One other thing that could cause problems inside the tunnel are the screws that secure the power steering pipe clips to the underside of the chassis, some of the rubber plugs on my car have perished revealing the screw threads, not something you'd want rubbing away at your oil and coolant pipes, I'll be renewing those for sure.

Link to post
Share on other sites

One impediment to replacing the pipes was Lotus' tendency to zip-tie the pipes inside the backbone. 😣  (I can hear them snickering 'HeeHeeHee' even now.)

 

 

On the older G cars (up to '85) the lack of a triangulated support for the front control arms is what made removing the pipes possible?

Atwell Haines

'88 Esprit

Succasunna, NJ USA

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

Hi Steve (910Esprit),

I am not envious of your bright new pipes at all. ☺️

Looking at mine again from below, they are not coming out of the front, the cross member is not going to let them past. On the bright side if I took the fuel balance pipe out the lower pipes would come out with the engine still in the chassis I think.

I am hoping to receive new clips tomorrow (fingers crossed) and will experiment with the existing pipes to see if they can hold water before risking a replacement at this point in time.

cheers

-Chris

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know your engine is different to mine, but even with my engine out, I still had to bend the pipes past the chassis cross tube  somewhat to get them out, and in. Just saying that you don’t want to kink one of them. I’ll have to see if I can find any photos.

Margate Exotics.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

anyone got these pipes out yet ? I’ve got an engine Crane for hire 

Only here once

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

I’m defo calling bullshit on this entire topic of getting them pipes out with the engine in.

so - someone - please - get out the armchair and prove it 💪. A beer is up for grabs as a reward

the only way I can think is pulling them a few inches at a time and cutting them and repeating that process. New ones ain’t going in then unless they are flexi

and please please please - this is NOT a g-car issue - they are utterly different 

Only here once

Link to post
Share on other sites

For one of my Chargecooled V8 projects, I ran hardpipes under the backbone.  There is plenty of space, so maybe that is an option as an interim fix until the next time you need your engine removed.

1996 Esprit V8, 1998 Esprit V8 GT, 1999 Esprit S350 #002 (Esprit GT1 replica project), 1996 Esprit V8 GT1 (chassis 114-001), 1992 Lotus Omega (927E), 1999 Esprit V8SE, 1999 Esprit S350 #032, 1995 Esprit S4s, 1999 Esprit V8 GT (ex-5th Gear project), 1999 Esprit V8SE ('02 rear)

1999 S350 #002 Esprit GT1 replica

Link to post
Share on other sites

The issue with the heater (and charge cooler pipes if fitted) is the fuel tank balance pipe and the chassis tube are obstructing. Whilst the coolant pipes come out straight, the lower pipes don't. The fuel tank balance pipe has to be removed and the pipes bent up over the chassis cross tube. I stuck white arrows on them in the photo. There's no way they can be changed without engine removal.

So, like I said earlier Chris, you have two options:- Either drill holes in your chassis at the front as well as removing the rad-pack, or take the engine and box out.

And I'll stand anyone another pint as well as Barry because I'd be ever so pleased to be proved wrong!

InkedPhoto%2029-01-2017,%2014%2002%2057_preview_jpeg_LI.jpg

Margate Exotics.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

Ahhh we are all missing the obvious here.

the engine doesn’t need removing - I’ve figured it out. Just do it the way the are built.

remove the body - slip old pipes out - slip new pipes in. Can all be done with the engine in situ after all

Only here once

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Barrykearley said:

Ahhh we are all missing the obvious here.

the engine doesn’t need removing - I’ve figured it out. Just do it the way the are built.

remove the body - slip old pipes out - slip new pipes in. Can all be done with the engine in situ after all

Genius.

  • Haha 1

Margate Exotics.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM
1 hour ago, Chillidoggy said:

The issue with the heater (and charge cooler pipes if fitted) is the fuel tank balance pipe and the chassis tube are obstructing. Whilst the coolant pipes come out straight, the lower pipes don't. The fuel tank balance pipe has to be removed and the pipes bent up over the chassis cross tube. I stuck white arrows on them in the photo. There's no way they can be changed without engine removal.

So, like I said earlier Chris, you have two options:- Either drill holes in your chassis at the front as well as removing the rad-pack, or take the engine and box out.

And I'll stand anyone another pint as well as Barry because I'd be ever so pleased to be proved wrong!

InkedPhoto%2029-01-2017,%2014%2002%2057_preview_jpeg_LI.jpg

But that assumes you have to lift the pipes over the chassis tube (fuel pipe has to be removed, I will agree on that - shame I didn't do that before refilling after draining the stale fuel 😖) but it looks easier to take the pipes out below the chassis tube, its about the same amount of flexing required I am guessing, and this will then also clear the engine. Might earn me a beer.. 🍺

I am only looking at the lower pipes and right now only considering the one on the far left of the chassis (viewed from behind). I am still hopeful it will survive a little longer without replacing any.

My biggest concern is how you guide it through the hole in the chassis at the other end? Do you HAVE to take the gear leaver out and help guide them through with hands in that aperture or is there another technique? I am wondering if I have something longer than the pipe, flexible enough but not too bendy and with a smaller diameter than the pipe that I can insert into it before removal and use it as a guide for replacement. Perhaps a tent pole could work?

I assume the grommets have to stay in place and feed the tubes past them otherwise they are never going to be retrofitted, right?

cheers

-Chris

Link to post
Share on other sites

The lower pipes run underneath alloy cross-tubes in the chassis central spine (see photos) which means there is very little up or down movement when removing or replacing them. You have no choice but to remove the gearchange master and guide them through, which is easier with two people. It is better to refit the grommets after the pipes.

I will say it one last time though: You will not get them out with the engine in place, and certainly won't get them in, either.

 

Rear

 

Photo%2013-02-2017,%2014%2059%2018_preview[1].jpeg

 

Front

 

Photo%2013-02-2017,%2015%2005%2038_preview.jpeg

Margate Exotics.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

Have you fixed it yet?? Taking @mike_sekingers advice or @Sparkys top tips - you’d have the old girl sorted in less time than the questions 👍

Only here once

Link to post
Share on other sites

Go underneath the backbone, until you have the engine out next time.  Get's you mobile, so you can enjoy the car during the best parts of the season and start your love affair with the Esprit all over again.

IMG_3484.JPG

  • Like 2

1996 Esprit V8, 1998 Esprit V8 GT, 1999 Esprit S350 #002 (Esprit GT1 replica project), 1996 Esprit V8 GT1 (chassis 114-001), 1992 Lotus Omega (927E), 1999 Esprit V8SE, 1999 Esprit S350 #032, 1995 Esprit S4s, 1999 Esprit V8 GT (ex-5th Gear project), 1999 Esprit V8SE ('02 rear)

1999 S350 #002 Esprit GT1 replica

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

5 hours ago, Barrykearley said:

please please please - this is NOT a g-car issue - they are utterly different 

Are they?   Sorry for the inconvenience.  No more from me.   However,  Mike's solution is very neat and will clearly work.

Chris - As final confirmation, why not ask Pete Musgrove or Steve SJS and see what they say?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

I know of SJS but can you remind me who Pete is please? I know the name but cannot place the expertise. :-)

As luck would have it, I cleaned the inside of the pipe a little and went to poke my new camera down it in case I can see any obvious holes, and guess what, the camera is dead. 😞

cheers

-Chris

Link to post
Share on other sites

88 Esprit NA, 89 Esprit Turbo SE, Evora, Evora S, Evora IPS, Evora S IPS, Evora S IPS SR, Evora 400, Elise S1, Elise S1 111s, Evora GT410 Sport

Evora NA

For forum issues, please contact the Moderators. I will aim to respond to emails/PM's Mon-Fri 9-6 GMT. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

Ah yes, PNM, I am familiar with them too, thanks.

Progress on the pipe work has been slow this week, had to MOT the CRV and change the brakes on my daily runaround, the exotic Hyundai i30 CRDi, oh and a bit of work got in the way too.

Since the inspection camera gave up the ghost I decided there was no point continuing with the inspection so I have popped the pipes I took off back on, cleaned up and with new stainless jubilee clips from here https://www.namrick.co.uk/acatalog/Home_Hose_Clips_90.html. These are just a little bit fatter than standard clips and have a sturdy screw which all helps the confidence levels. 

Unfortunately I haven't had time to lower the car off the stands and fill the cooling system to test and I won't have time until next week as I am off to Spain to take part in an amateur 24 hour race at Ascari. The race is for cars 20 years or older (no mods other than safety stuff) that meet a certain power to weight ratio bracket, and only two sets of tyres are allowed for the whole race. The intention is to keep the racing close and costs down. We have an MX5 to share between six of us which is great, it's light so very easy on tyres and brakes. It's not the fastest and we won't ever win with it but its just really good fun.

I'll be back on the Esprit on Tuesday hopefully and will let you know if it's still leaking or not. Thanks again for all of the help and encouragement.

cheers

-Chris

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gold FFM

It’s got two chances chap. Decent clips will help there’s no doubt about that as will a good clean up of the mating faces.

these cars can be an utter pig at times - but All is forgiven once driven - so get her going 👍

Only here once

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...