Just Fitted Winter Tyres - thoughts and musings

[Bravo73]

If you’re getting 2 sets, I would definitely get the Continentals:

 

[Dave Eds]

14 hours ago, pete said:

What they like on black ice😈

No black ice in my understairs cupboard. ☹️

[electro_boy]

Right OK had a look at some other tests going back a few years and compared the relative performances of any reference all season tyre and summer tyres to the winter tyres and ...  its very condition dependant on which tyre works when.  There are some tests that show the winters give little to the summer tyres in the dry tests and outperform them in aquaplane tests and some showing the opposite.

But I think I've come to the conclusion the winters are probably the better compromise to make.  As it's when the conditions are really crappy that I'll really need their strengths.  When its warm and dry (relatively speaking for wintertime) it's easier to stay within the tyres limits and not need the extra performance of the summer tyre.  But when its cold and wet its easier to over step the line and need the extra grip of the winter tyres.

So now the puzzle of which exact winters ...  The top 3 tyres at the moment are Conti TS850P, Conti TS860S and Verdestine Wintrac Pro.  Unfortunately neither come in exact size for my 18/19 wheeled Evora, which requires 225/40/R18, 255/35/R19.

Conti TS860S is a new tyre made specially for high performance cars.  Has better performance in the dry than the TS850P, similar in the wet and slightly less grip in the snow.  The closest sizes I've found are 235/45/R18,  255/35/R19.  The rears match perfect but fronts are wider and much taller profile so I don't think these will be suitable?

Conti TS850P is a very good winter tyre winning in previous years tests, sizes are 225/40/R18, 235/40/R19.  Fronts are perfect but the rears add 1.5% to the diameter and 20mm narrower than standard so not sure if they will fit the wheel?

Verdestine Wintrac pro:  Very close performance to the Conti TS850P but slightly better in the dry.  Come in sizes 225/40/R18, 235/35/R19.  So again front is perfect fit but rears are 1.9% smaller in diameter and also concern over if the tyre are too narrow for the rims.  The rears also come in 245/40/R19 which is 2.7% bigger which might be a bit too much?

 

Any advice on which tyre size to go for is much appreciated.   Would it be sensible to mix the two Continental tyres together to get the correct sizes front and back?

[Techyd]

MICHELIN Pilot Alpins....these are cold weather tyres and come in the right sizes for you.

 

 

[electro_boy]

The only Pilot Aplin that fits my car are the Pilot Aplin 4 and the design is a few years old.  If going Michelin I think I'd rather go for the new CrossClimate+ which got very good results on Auto Expresses winter tyre test and came in second place!

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accessories-tyres/winter-driving-special/93097/winter-tyres-test-best-tyre-brands-reviewed

Or mix and match the Contis, use the TS850P up front and TS860S on the rear.  Thats got to give me better performance than the older Michelin design?

 

[electro_boy]

Anyone got any thoughts on my tyre options above? 

[electro_boy]

Hmm I maybe talking bollocks about the Michelin Pilot Alpin 4 being old and past it.   I just found reviews from 2017 and it compares very well against the Conti TS850P.   So while it is an older design tyre and Michelin have bought out newer designs, the Alpin 4 is very good.

This winter tyre stuff is hard work! I've rung round a few places to get advice and for a performance car they just don't know what to recommend.   I guess with summer tyres there is lots of feedback from customers and their own experiences but little with winter tyres.

[Techyd]

It’s a complex market for sure, no doubt being made complicated by very specific tyres for very specific uses. It’s Seems like it’s shaped up these days to make you second guess your choice - like buying a TV as well!

I’ve never had a bad tyre on my cars, having always stuck to premium brands so I suspect either of those Michelin’s will be good

[Bravo73]

9 hours ago, electro_boy said:

Or mix and match the Contis, use the TS850P up front and TS860S on the rear.

If you want the same tyre sizes as your summer tyres, I’d do this. For 99% of situations,  you won’t feel any difference in grip between the 2 axles. 

However, winter tyres are generally better in skinnier sizes when compared to summer tyres. So if you can get the same set but with slightly slimmer widths, I’d go for that.

PS I also think that you’re overthinking this slightly. 

 

[electro_boy]

Ha Ha, of course I'm overthinking this, thats what I always do!  I had exactly the same thought this morning! 😄

Woke up and thought "bugger it ... by the time I've gathered enough data and analysed it to the nth degree, not only will winter will be over but hover cars will have been invented so we won't even need tyres!"  

So decided to just go for the Michelin Alpin 4.  They come in the correct sizes, get good reviews and the local shop can hopefully get them in for this afternoon.  Queue the warmest, driest Feb and March in history of the earth! 😛 

 

[jep]

My Evora is now fitted with Vredestein Quatrec all season. Initial impressions (in mildly wet conditions, 5 degree temp) are good, no change to the feel or dynamic of the car. I assume the weakness of All Season tyres will be in the summer, I will report more as I find. 

Justin

[Bravo73]

On 28/01/2019 at 09:28, electro_boy said:

Anyone able to point me to a test done with summer tyres in cold buy dry conditions to see how performance carries with temperature? 

I know that you have already bought a set of winter tyres but you might find the results of this video interesting:

 

[electro_boy]

Thanks for the link.  Kind of validates what I was thinking, for drier conditions the all season is a better tyre.

Advice I got from Michelin was their CrossClimate+ was not designed to be stored (its designed to be constantly used), so they would not recommend using it as winter tyre and swapping it for a summer tyre later on.  Instead for me they recommended the Pilot Alpin 4 so that's what I went for. It was a very slow online chat system so I didn't hang around to ask them exactly what it was about the CrossClimate+ means that it does't store well.  I think the all season tyre is getting more development from many manufacturers in resent years and could end up being a very useful tyre for the south of UK.

I'm happy with my Pilot Alpin 4.  Under normal driving conditions you definitely feel the tyre is softer and keys into the road surface better than PS4 otherwise feels like any other good tyre.  On a spirited drive you can feel the tread block shift on initial turn in to a corner but then it stays there and the feel is consistent.  It takes a little while to get used to that sensation but once you know to expect it, everything is fine.  I've only used it briefly in snowy / slushy conditions and it behaved much better than a summer tyre, I just drove (carefully) and didn't really have think about getting traction etc I just drove the car and it was all an no event.  Was fun watching other peoples faces as I calmly went about my merry way.  Sure the summer or all season tyre may be faster but I'm not really driving for fun in the current climate, I can wait till warmer climate to go have fun in the car again, so I can put up with the reduced perforce in mild weather for better safety when the weather is really crap.